Discussion:
Complete Rubinstein
(too old to reply)
u***@jimmytseng.net
2008-01-30 11:26:07 UTC
Permalink
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)

I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.

As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
Rugby
2008-01-30 15:34:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
Incidently, Hank Drake has a wonderful set of reviews of just about
every single cd in the Edition.

Start at : www.amazon.ca/gp/cdp/member-reviews/AEV640MKB3I9J?ie=UTF8&display=public&page=10

Or make the link smaller at www.tinyurl.com

Or ''search" yourself under " drake rubinstein".

Rugby
h***@yahoo.com
2008-01-30 20:46:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rugby
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
Incidently, Hank Drake has a wonderful set of reviews of just about
every single cd in the Edition.
Start at : www.amazon.ca/gp/cdp/member-reviews/AEV640MKB3I9J?ie=UTF8&display=pub...
Or make the link smaller atwww.tinyurl.com
Or ''search" yourself under " drake rubinstein".
Rugby
I'd just buy single discs as they happen to come your way on eBay.
That way you you have a better chance of listening to each individual
cd.
Matthew B. Tepper
2008-01-30 21:04:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by h***@yahoo.com
Post by Rugby
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
Incidently, Hank Drake has a wonderful set of reviews of just about
every single cd in the Edition.
www.amazon.ca/gp/cdp/member-reviews/AEV640MKB3I9J?ie=UTF8&display=pub...
Or make the link smaller atwww.tinyurl.com
Or ''search" yourself under " drake rubinstein".
I'd just buy single discs as they happen to come your way on eBay.
That way you you have a better chance of listening to each individual cd.
It would make it much more difficult to get the special box, though.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
War is Peace. ** Freedom is Slavery. ** It's all Napster's fault!
William Sommerwerck
2008-01-30 21:41:10 UTC
Permalink
RCA's complete Rubinstein was another wonderful example (like the Toscanini
set) of how not to price a product. The individual disks were high-class (I
bought a few from BMG), but the price was way too high.
Morton
2008-01-31 02:31:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by William Sommerwerck
RCA's complete Rubinstein was another wonderful example (like the Toscanini
set) of how not to price a product. The individual disks were high-class (I
bought a few from BMG), but the price was way too high.
It is my understanding that they sold fewer than 1,000 sets worldwide,
and therefore stopped pressing them. Pity.

Morton Linder
h***@yahoo.com
2008-01-31 16:06:49 UTC
Permalink
Thanks, Rugby, for the kind words regarding my reviews. I purchased
the complete set in early 2001, but was able to listen to individual
copies loaned from a friend.

It's my understanding that only about 200 complete boxes were made for
the initial run. Once they were sold (which took several years) BMG
decided not to issue any more complete sets. The individual CDs are
mostly available.

I concur with Matt that you should try looking for some of the best
CDs from the late mono period, they represent some of Rubinstein's
best playing. The stereo items will always be available in one form
or another--they were among the first items from RCA's back catalogue
issued when the CD format was first introduced. I worked in a record
store when they first came out. As I recall, when the Tchaikovsky/
Grieg concertos first appeared on CD, my manager told me they wouldn't
sell because they weren't "pure digital." All our copies were sold
within the week.

This is my first post on this board. I'm glad to see that Jeremy
Myers from Sony/BMG is also participating. It's nice to know that
someone from the record labels is "listening." Jeremy, I have always
been a fan of the Fleischer/Szell concerto recordings. Please keep
the Fleischer items coming, and maybe some of the Szell items which
haven't appeared on CD!

Best,
Hank
Post by Rugby
Incidently, Hank Drake has a wonderful set of reviews of just about
every single cd in the Edition.
Start at :        www.amazon.ca/gp/cdp/member-reviews/AEV640MKB3I9J?ie=UTF8&display=pub...
Or make the link smaller atwww.tinyurl.com
Or ''search" yourself under " drake rubinstein".
Rugby
h***@yahoo.com
2008-01-31 16:12:03 UTC
Permalink
This is my first post on this board.  I'm glad to see that Jeremy
Myers from Sony/BMG is also participating.  It's nice to know that
someone from the record labels is "listening."  Jeremy, I have always
been a fan of the Fleischer/Szell concerto recordings.  Please keep
the Fleischer items coming, and maybe some of the Szell items which
haven't appeared on CD!
Best,
Hank
OOPS! I meant Jeremy MEYERS!
Matt
2008-01-30 22:30:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
I believe it lost quite a bit of money, so I would suspect that it will
never be re-released. The Chopin, Beethoven concertos, etc. will probably
always be readily available, but I wouldn't hold my breath for the more
obscure items. I would suggest prioritizing and buying the most desirable
discs second-hand. If you own none of them I would suggest starting with
the second mono Chopin cycle (which I much prefer to the more familiar
stereo remakes).
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I've been re-listening to the Taneyev Quartet's Shostakovich cycle over the
last few days, and if you're interested in the repetoire, I believe it an
essential purchase. The Borodins, excellent as they are, do not have a
monopoly on this market. The Taneyev's are particularly good at making
musical sense of the last quartets, which can sometimes sound like
note-spinning in the hands of even otherwise very capable chamber groups.

I've been less thrilled with the Quatuor Danel (in the same repetoire)
despite wanting vey much to like them. Perhaps I need to give them more
time (I only received the box last week). They're very different from the
Soviet ensembles, and their aproach still sounds "wrong" to my ears.

Regards,
Matt
u***@jimmytseng.net
2008-01-31 12:05:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Matt
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
I believe it lost quite a bit of money, so I would suspect that it will
never be re-released.  The Chopin, Beethoven concertos, etc. will probably
always be readily available, but I wouldn't hold my breath for the more
obscure items.  I would suggest prioritizing and buying the most desirable
discs second-hand.  If you own none of them I would suggest starting with
the second mono Chopin cycle (which I much prefer to the more familiar
stereo remakes).
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I've been re-listening to the Taneyev Quartet's Shostakovich cycle over the
last few days, and if you're interested in the repetoire, I believe it an
essential purchase.  The Borodins, excellent as they are, do not have a
monopoly on this market.  The Taneyev's are particularly good at making
musical sense of the last quartets, which can sometimes sound like
note-spinning in the hands of even otherwise very capable chamber groups.
I've been less thrilled with the Quatuor Danel (in the same repetoire)
despite wanting vey much to like them.  Perhaps I need to give them more
time (I only received the box last week).  They're very different from the
Soviet ensembles, and their aproach still sounds "wrong" to my ears.
Regards,
Matt
Thanks for the recommendations. I'll see if my local library has it
first, otherwise it'll be another purchase!
Steve de Mena
2008-01-31 00:34:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.

But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.

Steve
m***@comcast.net
2008-01-31 02:01:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
These would both make great "bargain brick" sets. Perhaps if EMI
sells loads of their complete Karajan edition,
other labels would follow suit.

Marc Perman
Jeremy Meyers
2008-01-31 02:59:59 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring. I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.

j

--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
e: ***@sonybmg.com
Todd Schurk
2008-01-31 03:06:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring. I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
I wish you would honor a true Columbia/Sony/Bmg artist while he is
living with a comparable edition-one Leon Fleisher...and I don't
consider that disgrace of bleeding hunks that was just issued as an
"honor"...really-the "scherzo" of the Brahms Piano Quintet-absurd, but
telling at the same time. Disgusting. Todd S.
m***@comcast.net
2008-01-31 03:51:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Todd Schurk
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring. I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
I wish you would honor a true Columbia/Sony/Bmg artist while he is
living with a comparable edition-one Leon Fleisher...and I don't
consider that disgrace of bleeding hunks that was just issued as an
"honor"...really-the "scherzo" of the Brahms Piano Quintet-absurd, but
telling at the same time. Disgusting. Todd S.
Ormandy and Szell editions please!

Marc Perman
Jeremy Meyers
2008-01-31 04:03:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by m***@comcast.net
Post by Todd Schurk
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring. I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
I wish you would honor a true Columbia/Sony/Bmg artist while he is
living with a comparable edition-one Leon Fleisher...and I don't
consider that disgrace of bleeding hunks that was just issued as an
"honor"...really-the "scherzo" of the Brahms Piano Quintet-absurd, but
telling at the same time. Disgusting. Todd S.
Ormandy and Szell editions please!
Marc Perman
stay tuned later this year.

j

--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
e: ***@sonybmg.com
Matthew B. Tepper
2008-01-31 05:27:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
Post by m***@comcast.net
Ormandy and Szell editions please!
stay tuned later this year.
I will be very interested (and patient) to see what you mean by that.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
War is Peace. ** Freedom is Slavery. ** It's all Napster's fault!
Tony
2008-01-31 07:00:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
Post by m***@comcast.net
Post by Todd Schurk
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring.  I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
I wish you would honor a true Columbia/Sony/Bmg artist while he is
living with a comparable edition-one Leon Fleisher...and I don't
consider that disgrace of bleeding hunks that was just issued as an
"honor"...really-the "scherzo" of the Brahms Piano Quintet-absurd, but
telling at the same time. Disgusting. Todd S.
Ormandy and Szell editions please!
Marc Perman
stay tuned later this year.
oh come now, no need to be coy with us!

cheers,
Tony
d***@yahoo.com
2008-02-02 05:32:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by m***@comcast.net
Post by Todd Schurk
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring.  I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
I wish you would honor a true Columbia/Sony/Bmg artist while he is
living with a comparable edition-one Leon Fleisher...and I don't
consider that disgrace of bleeding hunks that was just issued as an
"honor"...really-the "scherzo" of the Brahms Piano Quintet-absurd, but
telling at the same time. Disgusting. Todd S.
Ormandy and Szell editions please!
Don't be silly.

TD
Jeremy Meyers
2008-01-31 04:02:25 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 19:06:03 -0800 (PST), Todd Schurk
Post by Todd Schurk
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring. I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
I wish you would honor a true Columbia/Sony/Bmg artist while he is
living with a comparable edition-one Leon Fleisher...and I don't
consider that disgrace of bleeding hunks that was just issued as an
"honor"...really-the "scherzo" of the Brahms Piano Quintet-absurd, but
telling at the same time. Disgusting. Todd S.
I would argue that you, Sir, were not at all the target audience for
The Essential Leon Fleisher. Would you rather we not provide a way
for a neophyte to get into " a true artist"s recorded works, and
instead only leave it to people who already know allabout his recorded
works?? I would say that that is the absurd position.

j

--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
e: ***@sonybmg.com
Todd Schurk
2008-01-31 06:31:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 19:06:03 -0800 (PST), Todd Schurk
Post by Todd Schurk
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring. I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
I wish you would honor a true Columbia/Sony/Bmg artist while he is
living with a comparable edition-one Leon Fleisher...and I don't
consider that disgrace of bleeding hunks that was just issued as an
"honor"...really-the "scherzo" of the Brahms Piano Quintet-absurd, but
telling at the same time. Disgusting. Todd S.
I would argue that you, Sir, were not at all the target audience for
The Essential Leon Fleisher. Would you rather we not provide a way
for a neophyte to get into " a true artist"s recorded works, and
instead only leave it to people who already know allabout his recorded
works?? I would say that that is the absurd position.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
Well, perhaps you might consider offering some intelligent and long
overdue packaging of neglected catalog (and I'm not just writing about
the estimable Fleisher) to your non-neophyte target audience-
yes,that's right-the people who have been buying Columbia/Sony/Bmg
classical for 35,45,50, years or more. Or do we not matter enough to
get an artist playing a complete work? Lame, Dude.
Todd Schurk
2008-01-31 06:59:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Todd Schurk
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 19:06:03 -0800 (PST), Todd Schurk
Post by Todd Schurk
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring. I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
I wish you would honor a true Columbia/Sony/Bmg artist while he is
living with a comparable edition-one Leon Fleisher...and I don't
consider that disgrace of bleeding hunks that was just issued as an
"honor"...really-the "scherzo" of the Brahms Piano Quintet-absurd, but
telling at the same time. Disgusting. Todd S.
I would argue that you, Sir, were not at all the target audience for
The Essential Leon Fleisher. Would you rather we not provide a way
for a neophyte to get into " a true artist"s recorded works, and
instead only leave it to people who already know allabout his recorded
works?? I would say that that is the absurd position.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
Well, perhaps you might consider offering some intelligent and long
overdue packaging of neglected catalog (and I'm not just writing about
the estimable Fleisher) to your non-neophyte target audience-
yes,that's right-the people who have been buying Columbia/Sony/Bmg
classical for 35,45,50, years or more. Or do we not matter enough to
get an artist playing a complete work? Lame, Dude.
Oh...and one more thing, I (and I guess a few others) was once that
"neophyte" and found my way just fine through a whole Beethoven
symphony or a complete Brahms Quintet. Are newbies to "classical"
music these days less able than we were? Todd S.
Matthew B. Tepper
2008-01-31 08:09:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by Todd Schurk
Oh...and one more thing, I (and I guess a few others) was once that
"neophyte" and found my way just fine through a whole Beethoven symphony or
a complete Brahms Quintet. Are newbies to "classical" music these days less
able than we were? Todd S.
When I was 10, I was taken to a performance of Mozart's "Magic Flute" (done
in English) and loved it. And it was the whole danged opera, not just a
collection of bits 'n' pieces that the Met does so the kiddies won't have to
stay seated for very long, the poor dears.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
War is Peace. ** Freedom is Slavery. ** It's all Napster's fault!
Jeremy Meyers
2008-01-31 13:28:59 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 22:59:48 -0800 (PST), Todd Schurk
Post by Todd Schurk
Post by Todd Schurk
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 19:06:03 -0800 (PST), Todd Schurk
Post by Todd Schurk
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring. I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
I wish you would honor a true Columbia/Sony/Bmg artist while he is
living with a comparable edition-one Leon Fleisher...and I don't
consider that disgrace of bleeding hunks that was just issued as an
"honor"...really-the "scherzo" of the Brahms Piano Quintet-absurd, but
telling at the same time. Disgusting. Todd S.
I would argue that you, Sir, were not at all the target audience for
The Essential Leon Fleisher. Would you rather we not provide a way
for a neophyte to get into " a true artist"s recorded works, and
instead only leave it to people who already know allabout his recorded
works?? I would say that that is the absurd position.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
Well, perhaps you might consider offering some intelligent and long
overdue packaging of neglected catalog (and I'm not just writing about
the estimable Fleisher) to your non-neophyte target audience-
yes,that's right-the people who have been buying Columbia/Sony/Bmg
classical for 35,45,50, years or more. Or do we not matter enough to
get an artist playing a complete work? Lame, Dude.
Oh...and one more thing, I (and I guess a few others) was once that
"neophyte" and found my way just fine through a whole Beethoven
symphony or a complete Brahms Quintet. Are newbies to "classical"
music these days less able than we were? Todd S.
No, but not every person who hears beethoven + brahms turns into a
lifelong classical devotee. There are some who own 5 or 6 recordings,
and maybe are interested in more.

There are levels of fandom, it's not binary.

--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
e: ***@sonybmg.com
William Sommerwerck
2008-01-31 13:51:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
Post by Todd Schurk
Oh...and one more thing, I (and I guess a few others) was once that
"neophyte" and found my way just fine through a whole Beethoven
symphony or a complete Brahms Quintet. Are newbies to "classical"
music these days less able than we were?
No, but not every person who hears beethoven + brahms turns into a
lifelong classical devotee. There are some who own 5 or 6 recordings,
and maybe are interested in more.
There are levels of fandom, it's not binary.
Though I had seen "Fantasia" at the age of 10 -- and it "planted the
seed" -- my first classical albums were "bleeding chunks". I particularly
remember several Command "highlight" albums. These sold for $2 or so.

I remember a 49-cent Capitol album of "The Hundred Greatest Melodies of All
Time". The intent was to get you to buy the full album.
Jeremy Meyers
2008-01-31 14:04:38 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 05:51:49 -0800, "William Sommerwerck"
Post by William Sommerwerck
Post by Jeremy Meyers
Post by Todd Schurk
Oh...and one more thing, I (and I guess a few others) was once that
"neophyte" and found my way just fine through a whole Beethoven
symphony or a complete Brahms Quintet. Are newbies to "classical"
music these days less able than we were?
No, but not every person who hears beethoven + brahms turns into a
lifelong classical devotee. There are some who own 5 or 6 recordings,
and maybe are interested in more.
There are levels of fandom, it's not binary.
Though I had seen "Fantasia" at the age of 10 -- and it "planted the
seed" -- my first classical albums were "bleeding chunks". I particularly
remember several Command "highlight" albums. These sold for $2 or so.
I remember a 49-cent Capitol album of "The Hundred Greatest Melodies of All
Time". The intent was to get you to buy the full album.
and now you can get samples of every track from all of our albums on
our website for free... a better deal than a $2 album of bleeding
chunks, no?

--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
e: ***@sonybmg.com
r***@gmail.com
2008-01-31 14:21:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 05:51:49 -0800, "William Sommerwerck"
Post by William Sommerwerck
Post by Jeremy Meyers
Post by Todd Schurk
Oh...and one more thing, I (and I guess a few others) was once that
"neophyte" and found my way just fine through a whole Beethoven
symphony or a complete Brahms Quintet. Are newbies to "classical"
music these days less able than we were?
No, but not every person who hears beethoven + brahms turns into a
lifelong classical devotee. There are some who own 5 or 6 recordings,
and maybe are interested in more.
There are levels of fandom, it's not binary.
Though I had seen "Fantasia" at the age of 10 -- and it "planted the
seed" -- my first classical albums were "bleeding chunks". I particularly
remember several Command "highlight" albums. These sold for $2 or so.
I remember a 49-cent Capitol album of "The Hundred Greatest Melodies of All
Time". The intent was to get you to buy the full album.
and now you can get samples of every track from all of our albums on
our website for free... a better deal than a $2 album of bleeding
chunks, no?
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
I'm very glad that you responded to, and participated in, this
discussion. I began collecting LPs in 1967 or so, in the UK, and
bought relatively few RCA and CBS records: EMI and Decca dominated. I
have many US- and UK-pressed Rubinstein and Heifetz LPs, and added
some CD reissues. (Also many Toscanini and Beecham LPs and some CDs) I
am perhaps more omnivorous than your 'normal' customer, and would be
willing to buy a new complete Rubinstein, Heifetz or perhaps Ormandy
as accompanist box priced comparably to the EMI Callas or Karajan sets
which I already bought despite much duplication.

The problem you seem to face is how to segment the market between
'bulk buyers' and 'selective' souls who only want X performed by Y,
and are willing to go to Japan to get it. In some sense the download
services permit the latter market to be served, but the pricing
structure does not serve the bulk buyers. The download services (and
Archiv) make the long-tail available to a greater extent than before,
but do not make it at all easy to promote awareness of what its
offered or to stimulate impulse buys, as in-store promotions, airplay
with label attribution, and magazine ads (High Fidelity, Stereo
Review, Gramophone, Hi Fi News etc) used to do.

Oddly, the copyright-infringing mass distribution channels (You Tube,
P2P nets and their ilk) may be the best way to make people aware of
recordings they might like; conversion to purchase is then the
problem.
Richard Simnett
Jeremy Meyers
2008-01-31 14:35:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by r***@gmail.com
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 05:51:49 -0800, "William Sommerwerck"
Post by William Sommerwerck
Post by Jeremy Meyers
Post by Todd Schurk
Oh...and one more thing, I (and I guess a few others) was once that
"neophyte" and found my way just fine through a whole Beethoven
symphony or a complete Brahms Quintet. Are newbies to "classical"
music these days less able than we were?
No, but not every person who hears beethoven + brahms turns into a
lifelong classical devotee. There are some who own 5 or 6 recordings,
and maybe are interested in more.
There are levels of fandom, it's not binary.
Though I had seen "Fantasia" at the age of 10 -- and it "planted the
seed" -- my first classical albums were "bleeding chunks". I particularly
remember several Command "highlight" albums. These sold for $2 or so.
I remember a 49-cent Capitol album of "The Hundred Greatest Melodies of All
Time". The intent was to get you to buy the full album.
and now you can get samples of every track from all of our albums on
our website for free... a better deal than a $2 album of bleeding
chunks, no?
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
I'm very glad that you responded to, and participated in, this
discussion. I began collecting LPs in 1967 or so, in the UK, and
bought relatively few RCA and CBS records: EMI and Decca dominated. I
have many US- and UK-pressed Rubinstein and Heifetz LPs, and added
some CD reissues. (Also many Toscanini and Beecham LPs and some CDs) I
am perhaps more omnivorous than your 'normal' customer, and would be
willing to buy a new complete Rubinstein, Heifetz or perhaps Ormandy
as accompanist box priced comparably to the EMI Callas or Karajan sets
which I already bought despite much duplication.
The problem you seem to face is how to segment the market between
'bulk buyers' and 'selective' souls who only want X performed by Y,
and are willing to go to Japan to get it. In some sense the download
services permit the latter market to be served, but the pricing
structure does not serve the bulk buyers. The download services (and
Archiv) make the long-tail available to a greater extent than before,
but do not make it at all easy to promote awareness of what its
offered or to stimulate impulse buys, as in-store promotions, airplay
with label attribution, and magazine ads (High Fidelity, Stereo
Review, Gramophone, Hi Fi News etc) used to do.
Oddly, the copyright-infringing mass distribution channels (You Tube,
P2P nets and their ilk) may be the best way to make people aware of
recordings they might like; conversion to purchase is then the
problem.
Richard Simnett
All true, and excellent points. Further discussion is welcomed.

Except for Tepper.

j

--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
e: ***@sonybmg.com
Matthew B. Tepper
2008-01-31 15:47:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
All true, and excellent points. Further discussion is welcomed.
Except for Tepper.
In your dreams.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
War is Peace. ** Freedom is Slavery. ** It's all Napster's fault!
William Sommerwerck
2008-01-31 18:14:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
and now you can get samples of every track from all of our albums
on our website for free... a better deal than a $2 album of bleeding
chunks, no?
"Now he tells me..."

I didn't know this was available. I generally avoid record-company websites,
because they don't seem to offer anything useful. The Living Stereo SACD
site (for example) does zero -- zilch -- to promote the sale of these
recordings (eg, providing a way for the user to keep track of which he's
bought, automatic mailings announcing the latest titles, etc).

The people you should most be listening to are folks such as Tepper and me.
You need to give us what we want, or convince us that what Sony/BMG offers
is optimum (with respect to marketplace realities) and couldn't be
meaningfully improved, or some combination of the two.

Perhaps the fundamental problem of the classical music industry is having to
convince people to purchase -- or at least sample -- something they aren't
interested in or think they won't like. The slow downward spiral of
"serious" music (and that includes jazz, to some extent) began when kids
started having enough money to buy albums of music of quetionable quality
and limited longevity. (Ouch! Am I gonna get it on that one.) The bad drives
out the good. And when you aren't raised hearing "good" music (I include
Glenn Miller, Tommy Dorsey, and Duke Ellington amongst the purveyors of
"good" music), you don't know what it is, and you don't want it.

I can't help but think of that scene in "Back to the Future" when Marty runs
through (what to me sounds like) an absurd sequence of squealing chords, and
then tells the shocked audience "Your kids are gonna love that." Well, "Le
Marteau sans Maitre" makes more sense to me -- and I don't like "Le Marteau
sans Maitre".

The customer is not always right. But businesses should be trying to give
them him what he wants. Along those lines...

I've been whining about the need for Sony to reissue the CBS quadraphonic
library on hybrid SACD. Pentatone seems to be successful doing the same
thing for both existing Philips quad masters, and new recordings, such as
"Ruslan und Ludmylla". (By the way, I've bought at least 20 of these
recordings. Nudge-nudge, hint-hint, wink-wink.)

Do you understand why some of us are unhappy with the way Sony/BMG is (not)
exploiting its catalog? You don't hear the RCA folks griping that the Living
Stereo series doesn't sell. (I have every one of them, most purchased at
full retail price ($12). Most are good, some are duds, but I bought them to
demonstrate my support.)

The CBS quad/multitrack library has plenty of titles worth reissuing just in
stereo. As most are 30 to 40 years old, they should have amortized their
production cost. So what's the reason for _not_ issuing them as
single-inventory hybrid multi-ch (surround) SACDs? I'd buy a pile of them,
if only to replace my SQ LPs.

This isn't a rhetorical question -- I'd like a detailed explanation of the
economics of the situation. If Pentatone can do it, why not Sony/BMG?

Thank you.
Jeremy Meyers
2008-01-31 18:28:03 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 10:14:00 -0800, "William Sommerwerck"
Post by William Sommerwerck
Post by Jeremy Meyers
and now you can get samples of every track from all of our albums
on our website for free... a better deal than a $2 album of bleeding
chunks, no?
"Now he tells me..."
I didn't know this was available. I generally avoid record-company websites,
because they don't seem to offer anything useful. The Living Stereo SACD
site (for example) does zero -- zilch -- to promote the sale of these
recordings (eg, providing a way for the user to keep track of which he's
bought, automatic mailings announcing the latest titles, etc).
Are we now to serve as your librarians as well?

Yes i understand your point, and I am not happy with that site either.
Post by William Sommerwerck
The people you should most be listening to are folks such as Tepper and me.
You need to give us what we want, or convince us that what Sony/BMG offers
is optimum (with respect to marketplace realities) and couldn't be
meaningfully improved, or some combination of the two.
I dont have to be posting on this message board. Not one other
industry person from any label be it DG or Pentatone posts on this
messageboard. What more do you want?
Post by William Sommerwerck
Perhaps the fundamental problem of the classical music industry is having to
convince people to purchase -- or at least sample -- something they aren't
interested in or think they won't like. The slow downward spiral of
"serious" music (and that includes jazz, to some extent) began when kids
started having enough money to buy albums of music of quetionable quality
and limited longevity. (Ouch! Am I gonna get it on that one.) The bad drives
out the good. And when you aren't raised hearing "good" music (I include
Glenn Miller, Tommy Dorsey, and Duke Ellington amongst the purveyors of
"good" music), you don't know what it is, and you don't want it.
I can't help but think of that scene in "Back to the Future" when Marty runs
through (what to me sounds like) an absurd sequence of squealing chords, and
then tells the shocked audience "Your kids are gonna love that." Well, "Le
Marteau sans Maitre" makes more sense to me -- and I don't like "Le Marteau
sans Maitre".
The customer is not always right. But businesses should be trying to give
them him what he wants. Along those lines...
So which is it, should we be trying to 'educate' people on 'good'
music and to leave their plebian tastes behind, or should we be
serving what customers want?
Post by William Sommerwerck
I've been whining about the need for Sony to reissue the CBS quadraphonic
library on hybrid SACD. Pentatone seems to be successful doing the same
thing for both existing Philips quad masters, and new recordings, such as
"Ruslan und Ludmylla". (By the way, I've bought at least 20 of these
recordings. Nudge-nudge, hint-hint, wink-wink.)
Do you understand why some of us are unhappy with the way Sony/BMG is (not)
exploiting its catalog? You don't hear the RCA folks griping that the Living
Stereo series doesn't sell. (I have every one of them, most purchased at
full retail price ($12). Most are good, some are duds, but I bought them to
demonstrate my support.)
We are the RCA folks. We understand and we are also frustrated at not
being able to do more, but are confined by the realities of the
marketplace.
Post by William Sommerwerck
The CBS quad/multitrack library has plenty of titles worth reissuing just in
stereo. As most are 30 to 40 years old, they should have amortized their
production cost. So what's the reason for _not_ issuing them as
single-inventory hybrid multi-ch (surround) SACDs? I'd buy a pile of them,
if only to replace my SQ LPs.
if they had, then we would.
Post by William Sommerwerck
This isn't a rhetorical question -- I'd like a detailed explanation of the
economics of the situation. If Pentatone can do it, why not Sony/BMG?
pentatone is a much smaller shop that can dedicate more of their
financial resources to more esoteric titles because that is their
business model, and it takes less ROI to keep the lights on and keep
everyone employed (and as you may have heard, we are not doing the
best job of that already)

this is why we continually license titles to places like Arkiv, who
can press titles that have limited marketplace value but are highly
sought after by people with a deeper interest.
Post by William Sommerwerck
Thank you.
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
e: ***@sonybmg.com
William Sommerwerck
2008-01-31 18:48:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by William Sommerwerck
The customer is not always right. But businesses should be trying
to give them him what he wants. Along those lines...
So which is it, should we be trying to "educate" people on "good"
music and to leave their plebian tastes behind, or should we be
serving what customers want?
That wasn't my point (see below), but the answer should be "both". You give
people what they want to make a short-term profit, and "educate" them to
develop long-term customers.

Of course, I came to classical music by accident (probably a side-effect of
being queer -- no offense to anyone intended). But even 40 years ago, the
music industry had long abandoned any attempt to develop a new classical
audience.

Just as a side point... When I say "classical", I mean orchestral and
chamber music. Opera seems to be surviving very well on its own, thank you.
Post by William Sommerwerck
I've been whining about the need for Sony to reissue the CBS quadraphonic
library on hybrid SACD. Pentatone seems to be successful doing the same
thing for both existing Philips quad masters, and new recordings, such as
"Ruslan und Ludmylla". (By the way, I've bought at least 20 of these
recordings. Nudge-nudge, hint-hint, wink-wink.)
Do you understand why some of us are unhappy with the way Sony/BMG
is (not) exploiting its catalog? You don't hear the RCA folks griping
that the
Post by William Sommerwerck
Living Stereo series doesn't sell. (I have every one of them, most
purchased
Post by William Sommerwerck
at full retail price ($12). Most are good, some are duds, but I bought
them to
Post by William Sommerwerck
demonstrate my support.)
We are the RCA folks.
I know. I assumed there was still some division among the former labels --
ie, some people worked only on RCA projects.
We understand and we are also frustrated at not being able to do more,
but are confined by the realities of the marketplace.
Forgive me -- I'm not being sarcastic or mean-spirited -- but what _are_ the
realities of the marketplace? Inquiring minds want to know!

Does Sony/BMG really believe that hybrid multi-ch SACDs of CBS multitrack
material won't sell, when Pentatone (apparently) is at least breaking even?

You don't have to answer "right now", but I would really appreciate a
detailed answer.
This is why we continually license titles to places like Arkiv, who
can press titles that have limited marketplace value but are highly
sought after by people with a deeper interest.
But Arkiv isn't producing them in the format I want. And I believe most of
Arkiv's disks are burned, not pressed, which eliminates the mastering costs,
and the need to maintain an inventory, a major consideration in being able
to offer them.

A PROPOSAL... If there were a way to produce a downloadable DSD version of
these multi-ch masters, could they be burned by the customer to a DVD blank?
I'd rather have a pressed disk, but if this were the only way to get old
surround recordings...

Or... what about a direct-sale limited edition? If it doesn't sell well, it
goes out of print when the first production run is sold.
Jeremy Meyers
2008-01-31 20:32:16 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 10:48:56 -0800, "William Sommerwerck"
Post by William Sommerwerck
Post by William Sommerwerck
The customer is not always right. But businesses should be trying
to give them him what he wants. Along those lines...
So which is it, should we be trying to "educate" people on "good"
music and to leave their plebian tastes behind, or should we be
serving what customers want?
That wasn't my point (see below), but the answer should be "both". You give
people what they want to make a short-term profit, and "educate" them to
develop long-term customers.
Of course, I came to classical music by accident (probably a side-effect of
being queer -- no offense to anyone intended). But even 40 years ago, the
music industry had long abandoned any attempt to develop a new classical
audience.
Just as a side point... When I say "classical", I mean orchestral and
chamber music. Opera seems to be surviving very well on its own, thank you.
Post by William Sommerwerck
I've been whining about the need for Sony to reissue the CBS quadraphonic
library on hybrid SACD. Pentatone seems to be successful doing the same
thing for both existing Philips quad masters, and new recordings, such as
"Ruslan und Ludmylla". (By the way, I've bought at least 20 of these
recordings. Nudge-nudge, hint-hint, wink-wink.)
Do you understand why some of us are unhappy with the way Sony/BMG
is (not) exploiting its catalog? You don't hear the RCA folks griping
that the
Post by William Sommerwerck
Living Stereo series doesn't sell. (I have every one of them, most
purchased
Post by William Sommerwerck
at full retail price ($12). Most are good, some are duds, but I bought
them to
Post by William Sommerwerck
demonstrate my support.)
We are the RCA folks.
I know. I assumed there was still some division among the former labels --
ie, some people worked only on RCA projects.
nope, all one small team.
Post by William Sommerwerck
We understand and we are also frustrated at not being able to do more,
but are confined by the realities of the marketplace.
Forgive me -- I'm not being sarcastic or mean-spirited -- but what _are_ the
realities of the marketplace? Inquiring minds want to know!
Does Sony/BMG really believe that hybrid multi-ch SACDs of CBS multitrack
material won't sell, when Pentatone (apparently) is at least breaking even?
You don't have to answer "right now", but I would really appreciate a
detailed answer.
most of the titles you're talking about will end up selling under 1500
units ever.
Post by William Sommerwerck
This is why we continually license titles to places like Arkiv, who
can press titles that have limited marketplace value but are highly
sought after by people with a deeper interest.
But Arkiv isn't producing them in the format I want. And I believe most of
Arkiv's disks are burned, not pressed, which eliminates the mastering costs,
and the need to maintain an inventory, a major consideration in being able
to offer them.
A PROPOSAL... If there were a way to produce a downloadable DSD version of
these multi-ch masters, could they be burned by the customer to a DVD blank?
I'd rather have a pressed disk, but if this were the only way to get old
surround recordings...
if there is, someone please let me know.
Post by William Sommerwerck
Or... what about a direct-sale limited edition? If it doesn't sell well, it
goes out of print when the first production run is sold.
we are not currently set up for such things, sadly.

--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
e: ***@sonybmg.com
Matthew B. Tepper
2008-01-31 20:39:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
most of the titles you're talking about will end up selling under 1500
units ever.
A further impetus to license these to other labels and/or distributors.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
War is Peace. ** Freedom is Slavery. ** It's all Napster's fault!
Matthew B. Tepper
2008-01-31 20:39:02 UTC
Permalink
I dont have to be posting on this message board. Not one other industry
person from any label be it DG or Pentatone posts on this messageboard.
What more do you want?
Robert von Bahr, founder and head honcho of BIS, posts here. We have also
had occasional visits from Klaus Heymann, and lengthy stays from David
Starobin (who not only fronts the Bridge label, but is a formidable
guitarist).

Even though you don't have to be posting here, I'm glad you do. If I'm
wrong about an assumption I've made, or if I don't have my facts right, I
want to know about it.

I realize you feel you're taking some "heat" when you post here, but if
anything that's because you're a stand-in for the people who make some of
the absurd decisions in the biz.

I hope you'll stay. If you need to pin my ears back about something, go
right ahead. My ego can take it.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
War is Peace. ** Freedom is Slavery. ** It's all Napster's fault!
Tony
2008-02-01 05:14:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 10:14:00 -0800, "William Sommerwerck"
Post by William Sommerwerck
Post by Jeremy Meyers
and now you can get samples of every track from all of our albums
on our website for free... a better deal than a $2 album of bleeding
chunks, no?
"Now he tells me..."
I didn't know this was available. I generally avoid record-company websites,
because they don't seem to offer anything useful. The Living Stereo SACD
site (for example) does zero -- zilch -- to promote the sale of these
recordings (eg, providing a way for the user to keep track of which he's
bought, automatic mailings announcing the latest titles, etc).
Are we now to serve as your librarians as well?
Yes i understand your point, and I am not happy with that site either.
It is pretty sad that BMG/RCA Classical's webpage content and even
basic design from around 1995 was superior to almost every single
current page from the major labels. That BMG page was updated often
in every respect and included user discussion boards with
participation by many old posters here along with BMG employees. There
was a real flow of info, a real pipeline into the record business.
Post by Jeremy Meyers
Post by William Sommerwerck
The CBS quad/multitrack library has plenty of titles worth reissuing just in
stereo. As most are 30 to 40 years old, they should have amortized their
production cost. So what's the reason for _not_ issuing them as
single-inventory hybrid multi-ch (surround) SACDs? I'd buy a pile of them,
if only to replace my SQ LPs.
if they had, then we would.>This isn't a rhetorical question -- I'd like a detailed explanation of the
Post by William Sommerwerck
economics of the situation. If Pentatone can do it, why not Sony/BMG?
pentatone is a much smaller shop that can dedicate more of their
financial resources to more esoteric titles because that is their
business model, and it takes less ROI to keep the lights on and keep
everyone employed (and as you may have heard, we are not doing the
best job of that already)
this is why we continually license titles to places like Arkiv, who
can press titles that have limited marketplace value but are highly
sought after by people with a deeper interest.
That's a start. But Sony's allowing Arkiv to sell CD-Rs of some OOP
CDs is not at all the same as Sony licensing the source material (at a
reasonable rate) to companies who will process and release titles that
Sony has shown absolutely no interest in releasing and is unlikely to
ever release on its own. For example, both of John Kirkpatrick's
recordings of Ives' Concord Sonata (one of which is its premiere
recording) languish in the Sony vaults. I'm sure there are plenty of
labels out there who would be happy to license those tapes from Sony,
but Sony has a history of demanding exorbitant sums in licensing fees
in such propositions.

cheers,
Tony
William Sommerwerck
2008-02-01 15:28:24 UTC
Permalink
"Tony" <***@gmail.com> wrote in message news:1bde712d-5c63-43a3-a216-***@e4g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...

That's a start. But Sony's allowing Arkiv to sell CD-Rs of some OOP
CDs is not at all the same as Sony licensing the source material (at a
reasonable rate) to companies who will process and release titles that
Sony has shown absolutely no interest in releasing and is unlikely to
ever release on its own. For example, both of John Kirkpatrick's
recordings of Ives' Concord Sonata (one of which is its premiere
recording) languish in the Sony vaults. I'm sure there are plenty of
labels out there who would be happy to license those tapes from Sony,
but Sony has a history of demanding exorbitant sums in licensing fees
in such propositions.

Another example of this is the company (whose name I forget) who wanted to
reissue Partch's "Delusion of the Fury". Columbia hemmed and hawed for
years, then finally permitted it on the condition that the back of the album
read "A product of Columbia Special Products".
Gerard
2008-02-01 16:28:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by William Sommerwerck
That's a start. But Sony's allowing Arkiv to sell CD-Rs of some OOP
CDs is not at all the same as Sony licensing the source material (at a
reasonable rate) to companies who will process and release titles that
Sony has shown absolutely no interest in releasing and is unlikely to
ever release on its own. For example, both of John Kirkpatrick's
recordings of Ives' Concord Sonata (one of which is its premiere
recording) languish in the Sony vaults. I'm sure there are plenty of
labels out there who would be happy to license those tapes from Sony,
but Sony has a history of demanding exorbitant sums in licensing fees
in such propositions.
Nevertheless Brilliant Classics has reissued Mahler's Des Knaben Wunderhorn,
Kindertotenlieder, Rückertlieder, Lieder eines fahrenden Gesellen with Ludwig,
Berry, Bernstein, Baltsa, Maazel, Stade, and A.Davis.
William Sommerwerck
2008-02-01 16:37:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Gerard
Post by William Sommerwerck
That's a start. But Sony's allowing Arkiv to sell CD-Rs of some OOP
CDs is not at all the same as Sony licensing the source material (at a
reasonable rate) to companies who will process and release titles that
Sony has shown absolutely no interest in releasing and is unlikely to
ever release on its own. For example, both of John Kirkpatrick's
recordings of Ives' Concord Sonata (one of which is its premiere
recording) languish in the Sony vaults. I'm sure there are plenty of
labels out there who would be happy to license those tapes from Sony,
but Sony has a history of demanding exorbitant sums in licensing fees
in such propositions.
Nevertheless Brilliant Classics has reissued Mahler's Des Knaben Wunderhorn,
Kindertotenlieder, Rückertlieder, Lieder eines fahrenden Gesellen with Ludwig,
Berry, Bernstein, Baltsa, Maazel, Stade, and A.Davis.
Does anyone know how to contact someone at Brilliant other than the sales
department?
Matthew B. Tepper
2008-02-01 15:35:36 UTC
Permalink
Tony <***@gmail.com> appears to have caused the following letters to be
typed in news:1bde712d-5c63-43a3-a216-
It is pretty sad that BMG/RCA Classical's webpage content and even basic
design from around 1995 was superior to almost every single current page
from the major labels. That BMG page was updated often in every respect
and included user discussion boards with participation by many old posters
here along with BMG employees. There was a real flow of info, a real
pipeline into the record business.
I remember that site, www.classicalmusic.com -- it was truly excellent, and
offered real and helpful new release information, audio and even video clips
(in the days before broadband and large storage were the norm). But every
now and then it "went static" for a while, indicating that the powers-that-be
had lost faith in it, perhaps because it wasn't a revenue generator all by
itself. Twice this happened, and a cut-down and less useful version of the
site replaced it. Ultimately I logged onto that URL and found nothing but a
generic hosting page, what we would now call a "link farm"; it was sad.
For example, both of John Kirkpatrick's recordings of Ives' Concord Sonata
(one of which is its premiere recording) languish in the Sony vaults. I'm
sure there are plenty of labels out there who would be happy to license
those tapes from Sony, but Sony has a history of demanding exorbitant sums
in licensing fees in such propositions.
I've been working on a transfer of the stereo one. Unfortunately, there are
too many skips in my copy of the earlier recording, a library discard I must
have gotten at least 35 years ago.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
War is Peace. ** Freedom is Slavery. ** It's all Napster's fault!
James Kahn
2008-01-31 19:33:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by William Sommerwerck
The people you should most be listening to are folks such as Tepper and me.
You need to give us what we want, or convince us that what Sony/BMG offers
is optimum (with respect to marketplace realities) and couldn't be
meaningfully improved, or some combination of the two.
I just wanted to echo an earlier poster and express gratitude for
Mr. Meyers's participation here. He seems to be willing to listen
(and tolerate a certain amount of abuse, even), and I think we
should also listen to what he has to say. People here seem to
think that they know better how to run an operation like Sony
better than those who are doing it. I don't doubt that their
operation can be improved, but its raison d'etre is not to
serve Tepper and Sommerwerck. A little respect or politeness
wouldn't hurt--I'm enjoying the discussions and hope Mr. Meyers
sticks around.
--
Jim
New York, NY
(Please remove "nospam." to get my e-mail address)
http://www.panix.com/~kahn
u***@jimmytseng.net
2008-02-01 13:39:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by James Kahn
Post by William Sommerwerck
The people you should most be listening to are folks such as Tepper and me.
You need to give us what we want, or convince us that what Sony/BMG offers
is optimum (with respect to marketplace realities) and couldn't be
meaningfully improved, or some combination of the two.
I just wanted to echo an earlier poster and express gratitude for
Mr. Meyers's participation here.  He seems to be willing to listen
(and tolerate a certain amount of abuse, even), and I think we
should also listen to what he has to say.  People here seem to
think that they know better how to run an operation like Sony
better than those who are doing it.  I don't doubt that their
operation can be improved, but its raison d'etre is not to
serve Tepper and Sommerwerck.  A little respect or politeness
wouldn't hurt--I'm enjoying the discussions and hope Mr. Meyers
sticks around.  
--
Jim
New York, NY
(Please remove "nospam." to get my e-mail address)http://www.panix.com/~kahn
I second that!
William Sommerwerck
2008-02-01 16:10:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by James Kahn
Post by William Sommerwerck
The people you should most be listening to are folks such as
Tepper and me. You need to give us what we want, or convince
us that what Sony/BMG offers is optimum (with respect to marketplace
realities) and couldn't be meaningfully improved, or some combination
of the two.
I just wanted to echo an earlier poster and express gratitude for
Mr. Meyers's participation here. He seems to be willing to listen
(and tolerate a certain amount of abuse, even), and I think we
should also listen to what he has to say. People here seem to
think that they know better how to run an operation like Sony
better than those who are doing it. I don't doubt that their
operation can be improved, but its raison d'etre is not to serve
Tepper and Sommerwerck. A little respect or politeness
wouldn't hurt -- I'm enjoying the discussions and hope Mr.
Meyers sticks around.
The following is a bit blunt in a few spots, but I hope Mr. Meyers and the
rest of rmcr will read it, consider, and respond.

I, too, am grateful that someone from a company whose products I've been
purchasing for more than 40 years is willing to communicate directly with
his customers. And I appreciate Mr. Meyers saying that he wishes he knew of
a way of burning an SACD to a DVD blank, rather than casually dismissing my
suggestion. (Sony probably hasn't developed the software to do this -- they
don't want people duplicating SACDs.) Few businesspeople would enter "into
the fray" or admit that a customer's suggestion has merit. Mr. Meyers has
done both.

But too many businesses think customers are supposed to be happy with
whatever they deign to offer. (Microsoft is a good example, but hardly the
only one. Look at Apple's mishandling of the iPhone rebate.) Why should
they? Are we supposed to get down on our knees and say "Oh thank you, thank
you, thank you, Sony/BMG, for making only a sliver of your back catalog
available in modern formats or improved transfers?"

As a customer, it is indeed my place to tell any company what I want, and
how I think they should run their business. It is Sony/BMG's obligation to,
if at all possible, meet the requests of me, Mr. Tepper, and everyone else
in this group. That's why they're in business -- not to make money, but to
sell stuff people want and will purchase (of which making money is the
by-product).

Although the numerical majority of my purchases are $2 CDs from BMG Music, I
nevertheless regularly support my local independent dealer, Silver Platters.
In 2006 I bought over $600+ of recordings on Black Friday, and almost $200
worth on this year's BF. (Almost all SACDs both years, by the way.) I buy
several hundred dollars worth of other recordings throughout the year.
(Paradoxically, it's the cheap BMG CDs that make it possible to give that
sort of support to Silver Platters.)

As are many of the members of this group, I am a true music "consumer". I
purchase far more -- in quantity and price -- than the average (pop/rock)
listener. So I have no hesitation in feeling I have the right to tell
companies what I want, because if they provide it, I'll probably buy it.

I'm fully aware that any business has to at least "break even" to survive.
It can't do that if it invests its (too-often limited) capital in products
no one wants, and (to a lesser extent) if it fails to promote its products
in a way that creates an interest in them. Deciding where to invest that
capital can be confusing.

Mr. Meyers pointed out that some recordings sell less than 1500 units
worldwide. I see no reason not to believe this. (Remember a recent opera
recording that cost hundreds of thousands of dollars to produce, and sold
only a few hundred copies?) Of course, it's not so important whether any one
title makes or loses money, but whether the business as a whole is
profitable. A few bombs don't matter if other titles more than make up for
them.

As new recordings become more expensive to produce, record companies have to
find ways to squeeze more money out of their older recordings. Sony/BMG
doesn't seem to have been very successful at it with respect to the Columbia
back catalog. I suspect the general failure of the Heritage series might be
the problem, and might explain why Sony/BMG seems unable to stop feasting on
Glenn G[h]ould's musical corpse -- it's desperately afraid to reissue
anything from Columbia it isn't reasonably certain will be a success.

On the other hand, the SACD Living Stereo series has been a resounding
success, despite SACD's relatively small penetration. (Does anyone know what
percentage of "serious" opera/classical listeners own an SACD player?) Why
is this?

1. These are "golden-age" recordings, which sell on the basis of sound
quality almost as much as performance.
2. Many are great performances from great performers.
3. They've been released in groups, as part of a continuing series. This
both draws attention to the reissues and engages the natural desire of males
to acquire "mass quantities" of material possessions. <ahem>
4. They're fairly priced ($12). (Silver Platters told me the SACD Living
Presence recordings don't sell as well. Whether this is because they cost
50% more, or there's less interest in Paray and Dorati, isn't clear. I'd
like to think it's the former.)
5. They're _promoted_ as great recordings.

The third, fourth, and fifth points seem crucial to me. The Living Stereo
SACDs (at least initially) were promoted vigorously -- these were great
recordings of great performances you absolutely _had_ to have. And the price
made them virtually an impulse purchase.

Sony/BMG should initiate a parallel series of Columbia reissues drawn from
its '60s (and later) multitrack recordings, releasing 20 to 30 titles a year
as hybrid multi-ch SACDs. There are enough great performances and/or sonic
spectaculars among these recordings to keep Sony/BMG busy for a couple of
years. If they promote this product, even to the point of shoving it the
customer's face, IT WILL SELL, just as it did with RCA. (And let us not
overlook the promotional value of reissuing "The World of Harry Partch" with
a "Parental Advisory" sticker on it.)

So my question to Jeremy Meyers is... Why isn't this being done? I don't
expect an immediate answer. All I ask is that Mr. Meyers to research the
question, and return with a considered answer. And if he'd like to discuss
it with me (425-235-9579), I'd be more than happy to go through my 100+
Columbia SQ LPs and decide which would be likely to sell well.

I'm not an ogre -- I just play one on UseNet.

PS: Dr. Land was famous for letting anyone ask him any question they liked
at the stockholder meetings. He wasn't afraid. Of course, until the early
'70s, Polaroid was a highly profitable company.
Norman M. Schwartz
2008-02-01 16:43:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by William Sommerwerck
Post by William Sommerwerck
As a customer, it is indeed my place to tell any company what I want, and
how I think they should run their business. It is Sony/BMG's obligation to,
if at all possible, meet the requests of me, Mr. Tepper, and everyone else
in this group. That's why they're in business -- not to make money, but to
sell stuff people want and will purchase (of which making money is the
by-product).
Any way you care to put it, too few people want it, to take it, even if it
were free.
James Kahn
2008-02-01 19:12:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by William Sommerwerck
As a customer, it is indeed my place to tell any company what I want, and
how I think they should run their business. It is Sony/BMG's obligation to,
if at all possible, meet the requests of me, Mr. Tepper, and everyone else
in this group. That's why they're in business -- not to make money, but to
sell stuff people want and will purchase (of which making money is the
by-product).
I more or less agree with the first sentence, disagree with the rest.
Sony/BMG's obligation is to their shareholders, and they are in business
to make money. If you want them to do something, you'll have to
convince them that it's in their financial interest. That doesn't
mean they necessarily have to turn a profit on every single thing
they do, and you might argue that by engaging in certain unprofitable
activities they enhance their reputation, improve customer loyalty,
or the like. But they are certainly under no "obligation" to meet
your requests.
--
Jim
New York, NY
(Please remove "nospam." to get my e-mail address)
http://www.panix.com/~kahn
William Sommerwerck
2008-02-01 21:02:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by James Kahn
Post by William Sommerwerck
As a customer, it is indeed my place to tell any company what I
want, and how I think they should run their business. It is Sony/BMG's
obligation to, if at all possible, meet the requests of me, Mr. Tepper,
and everyone else in this group. That's why they're in business -- not
to make money, but to sell stuff people want and will purchase (of which
making money is the by-product).
I more or less agree with the first sentence, disagree with the rest.
Sony/BMG's obligation is to their shareholders, and they are in business
to make money. If you want them to do something, you'll have to
convince them that it's in their financial interest. That doesn't
mean they necessarily have to turn a profit on every single thing
they do, and you might argue that by engaging in certain unprofitable
activities they enhance their reputation, improve customer loyalty,
or the like. But they are certainly under no "obligation" to meet
your requests.
You'll notice I said "if at all possible". That leaves a lot of wiggle room.

Businesses that are in business only to make money, and who are more
interested in their stockholders than their customers, often self-destruct
(qv, Enron as a recent example). Many of the problems of capitalism derive
from putting profits above everything else.

It's interesting that Dr. Land, very much a left-wing social liberal, who
gave away much of his wealth to the community, felt that a good product
should return a good profit. There's nothing wrong with profits -- the issue
is what you do with them.
James Kahn
2008-02-01 22:31:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by William Sommerwerck
Post by James Kahn
Post by William Sommerwerck
As a customer, it is indeed my place to tell any company what I
want, and how I think they should run their business. It is Sony/BMG's
obligation to, if at all possible, meet the requests of me, Mr. Tepper,
and everyone else in this group. That's why they're in business -- not
to make money, but to sell stuff people want and will purchase (of which
making money is the by-product).
I more or less agree with the first sentence, disagree with the rest.
Sony/BMG's obligation is to their shareholders, and they are in business
to make money. If you want them to do something, you'll have to
convince them that it's in their financial interest. That doesn't
mean they necessarily have to turn a profit on every single thing
they do, and you might argue that by engaging in certain unprofitable
activities they enhance their reputation, improve customer loyalty,
or the like. But they are certainly under no "obligation" to meet
your requests.
You'll notice I said "if at all possible". That leaves a lot of wiggle room.
It's certainly possible for them to meet your requests,
but not necessarily profitable.
Post by William Sommerwerck
Businesses that are in business only to make money, and who are more
interested in their stockholders than their customers, often self-destruct
(qv, Enron as a recent example). Many of the problems of capitalism derive
from putting profits above everything else.
Dunno, Enron screwed its shareholders. Usually there's not much conflict
between profits and satisfying customers (see Smith, Adam, 1776). Note I
said "usually."
Post by William Sommerwerck
It's interesting that Dr. Land, very much a left-wing social liberal, who
gave away much of his wealth to the community, felt that a good product
should return a good profit. There's nothing wrong with profits -- the issue
is what you do with them.
On this we agree.
--
Jim
New York, NY
(Please remove "nospam." to get my e-mail address)
http://www.panix.com/~kahn
Steve de Mena
2008-02-01 23:44:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by William Sommerwerck
Post by James Kahn
Post by William Sommerwerck
As a customer, it is indeed my place to tell any company what I
want, and how I think they should run their business. It is Sony/BMG's
obligation to, if at all possible, meet the requests of me, Mr. Tepper,
and everyone else in this group. That's why they're in business -- not
to make money, but to sell stuff people want and will purchase (of which
making money is the by-product).
I more or less agree with the first sentence, disagree with the rest.
Sony/BMG's obligation is to their shareholders, and they are in business
to make money. If you want them to do something, you'll have to
convince them that it's in their financial interest. That doesn't
mean they necessarily have to turn a profit on every single thing
they do, and you might argue that by engaging in certain unprofitable
activities they enhance their reputation, improve customer loyalty,
or the like. But they are certainly under no "obligation" to meet
your requests.
You'll notice I said "if at all possible". That leaves a lot of wiggle room.
Businesses that are in business only to make money, and who are more
interested in their stockholders than their customers, often self-destruct
(qv, Enron as a recent example). Many of the problems of capitalism derive
from putting profits above everything else.
Well, I think it should be assumed that Sony puts profits above
everything else, for better or for worse, and move on from there.

Steve
Jeremy Meyers
2008-02-01 23:50:31 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 01 Feb 2008 15:44:42 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by William Sommerwerck
Post by James Kahn
Post by William Sommerwerck
As a customer, it is indeed my place to tell any company what I
want, and how I think they should run their business. It is Sony/BMG's
obligation to, if at all possible, meet the requests of me, Mr. Tepper,
and everyone else in this group. That's why they're in business -- not
to make money, but to sell stuff people want and will purchase (of which
making money is the by-product).
I more or less agree with the first sentence, disagree with the rest.
Sony/BMG's obligation is to their shareholders, and they are in business
to make money. If you want them to do something, you'll have to
convince them that it's in their financial interest. That doesn't
mean they necessarily have to turn a profit on every single thing
they do, and you might argue that by engaging in certain unprofitable
activities they enhance their reputation, improve customer loyalty,
or the like. But they are certainly under no "obligation" to meet
your requests.
You'll notice I said "if at all possible". That leaves a lot of wiggle room.
Businesses that are in business only to make money, and who are more
interested in their stockholders than their customers, often self-destruct
(qv, Enron as a recent example). Many of the problems of capitalism derive
from putting profits above everything else.
Well, I think it should be assumed that Sony puts profits above
everything else, for better or for worse, and move on from there.
Steve
"not releasing everything in our vaults in quadraphonic SACD" is not
the same as defrauding our customers. I resent the Enron comparison.
j

--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
e: ***@sonybmg.com
Steve de Mena
2008-02-02 00:29:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Fri, 01 Feb 2008 15:44:42 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by William Sommerwerck
Post by James Kahn
Post by William Sommerwerck
As a customer, it is indeed my place to tell any company what I
want, and how I think they should run their business. It is Sony/BMG's
obligation to, if at all possible, meet the requests of me, Mr. Tepper,
and everyone else in this group. That's why they're in business -- not
to make money, but to sell stuff people want and will purchase (of which
making money is the by-product).
I more or less agree with the first sentence, disagree with the rest.
Sony/BMG's obligation is to their shareholders, and they are in business
to make money. If you want them to do something, you'll have to
convince them that it's in their financial interest. That doesn't
mean they necessarily have to turn a profit on every single thing
they do, and you might argue that by engaging in certain unprofitable
activities they enhance their reputation, improve customer loyalty,
or the like. But they are certainly under no "obligation" to meet
your requests.
You'll notice I said "if at all possible". That leaves a lot of wiggle room.
Businesses that are in business only to make money, and who are more
interested in their stockholders than their customers, often self-destruct
(qv, Enron as a recent example). Many of the problems of capitalism derive
from putting profits above everything else.
Well, I think it should be assumed that Sony puts profits above
everything else, for better or for worse, and move on from there.
Steve
"not releasing everything in our vaults in quadraphonic SACD" is not
the same as defrauding our customers. I resent the Enron comparison.
j
Someone else made that comparison, not me. I don't agree with that
either.

Steve
Post by Jeremy Meyers
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
Jeremy Meyers
2008-02-02 01:40:07 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 01 Feb 2008 16:29:10 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Fri, 01 Feb 2008 15:44:42 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by William Sommerwerck
Post by James Kahn
Post by William Sommerwerck
As a customer, it is indeed my place to tell any company what I
want, and how I think they should run their business. It is Sony/BMG's
obligation to, if at all possible, meet the requests of me, Mr. Tepper,
and everyone else in this group. That's why they're in business -- not
to make money, but to sell stuff people want and will purchase (of which
making money is the by-product).
I more or less agree with the first sentence, disagree with the rest.
Sony/BMG's obligation is to their shareholders, and they are in business
to make money. If you want them to do something, you'll have to
convince them that it's in their financial interest. That doesn't
mean they necessarily have to turn a profit on every single thing
they do, and you might argue that by engaging in certain unprofitable
activities they enhance their reputation, improve customer loyalty,
or the like. But they are certainly under no "obligation" to meet
your requests.
You'll notice I said "if at all possible". That leaves a lot of wiggle room.
Businesses that are in business only to make money, and who are more
interested in their stockholders than their customers, often self-destruct
(qv, Enron as a recent example). Many of the problems of capitalism derive
from putting profits above everything else.
Well, I think it should be assumed that Sony puts profits above
everything else, for better or for worse, and move on from there.
Steve
"not releasing everything in our vaults in quadraphonic SACD" is not
the same as defrauding our customers. I resent the Enron comparison.
j
Someone else made that comparison, not me. I don't agree with that
either.
Steve
sorry, wasn't aimed at you Steve

j
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by Jeremy Meyers
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
e: ***@sonybmg.com
Todd Schurk
2008-02-02 00:29:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Fri, 01 Feb 2008 15:44:42 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by William Sommerwerck
Post by James Kahn
Post by William Sommerwerck
As a customer, it is indeed my place to tell any company what I
want, and how I think they should run their business. It is Sony/BMG's
obligation to, if at all possible, meet the requests of me, Mr. Tepper,
and everyone else in this group. That's why they're in business -- not
to make money, but to sell stuff people want and will purchase (of which
making money is the by-product).
I more or less agree with the first sentence, disagree with the rest.
Sony/BMG's obligation is to their shareholders, and they are in business
to make money. If you want them to do something, you'll have to
convince them that it's in their financial interest. That doesn't
mean they necessarily have to turn a profit on every single thing
they do, and you might argue that by engaging in certain unprofitable
activities they enhance their reputation, improve customer loyalty,
or the like. But they are certainly under no "obligation" to meet
your requests.
You'll notice I said "if at all possible". That leaves a lot of wiggle room.
Businesses that are in business only to make money, and who are more
interested in their stockholders than their customers, often self-destruct
(qv, Enron as a recent example). Many of the problems of capitalism derive
from putting profits above everything else.
Well, I think it should be assumed that Sony puts profits above
everything else, for better or for worse, and move on from there.
Steve
"not releasing everything in our vaults in quadraphonic SACD" is not
the same as defrauding our customers. I resent the Enron comparison.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
Mr. Meyers-perhaps on the Sony/Classical site you could run a survey
of sorts...take suggestions/or list them yourself of Columbia/Sony/Rca/
Bmg back catalog items that have not seen lp/cd issue and let folks
vote on what they would purchase if offered? It couldn't hurt.
And,thanks for listening. Todd S.
Matthew B. Tepper
2008-02-02 01:53:34 UTC
Permalink
Mr. Meyers-perhaps on the Sony/Classical site you could run a survey of
sorts...take suggestions/or list them yourself of Columbia/Sony/Rca/Bmg
back catalog items that have not seen lp/cd issue and let folks vote on
what they would purchase if offered? It couldn't hurt.
And, thanks for listening. Todd S.
From 1995, when I first got Web access, I have closely followed the sites of
various classical labels. One thing common to all of them is that, whenever
there have been bulletin boards or discussion fora open to posted comments
from the general public, there have *always* been people asking for reissues
of one or another favored recordings.

I'm certainly not trying to trounce you here, just pointing out that it is
not a new idea. I imagine that before the Web, record company executives
received the occasional letter from customers suggesting possible reissues.
The label websites just opened up this trickle to a full-fledged flow.

Mr. Meyers has appeared here and most cordially asked us for our opinions.
We're only a part of the customer base he must serve; it behooves us to
remember that. Sony BMG will, no doubt, reissue Glenn Gould recordings again
and again and again until the cows come home, and I will roll my eyes every
time, but if I can get some of the items I want, it will alleviate my
annoyance considerably.

Note that when some of the recordings I crave have become available, I have
eagerly purchased them: Bernstein's Stravinsky "Oedipus Rex" (from the UK);
Craft's Chicago Brahms-Schoenberg; Levine's Chicago Brahms cycle (from
Japan); Yo-Yo Ma's first recording, the Finzi Cello Concerto (on Lyrita); and
so forth. And commerce being what it is, I think my suggestions have been
relatively reasonable. I'm not asking for reissues of obscure recordings of
music by Alexei Haieff, meritorious though they might be, but neglected items
that I think might well sell, like, well, Szell. And Ormandy too.

So let's cut some slack for Mr. Meyers, who doesn't deserve the open abuse
that Bill has been levelling at him. Bill, count to ten before you post!
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
War is Peace. ** Freedom is Slavery. ** It's all Napster's fault!
William Sommerwerck
2008-02-02 02:37:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Matthew B. Tepper
So let's cut some slack for Mr. Meyers, who doesn't deserve the open
abuse that Bill has been levelling at him. Bill, count to ten before you
post!

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10

When Mr. Meyers starts actually listening to us, taking what we say
seriously, and giving thoughtful answers to our questions and requests, then
I will stop "abusing" him.

Mr. Meyers is here solely to serve the interests of Sony/BMG, not ours.
u***@yahoo.com
2008-02-02 12:40:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by William Sommerwerck
Post by Matthew B. Tepper
So let's cut some slack for Mr. Meyers, who doesn't deserve the open
abuse that Bill has been levelling at him. Bill, count to ten before you
post!
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10
When Mr. Meyers starts actually listening to us, taking what we say
seriously, and giving thoughtful answers to our questions and requests, then
I will stop "abusing" him.
Mr. Meyers is here solely to serve the interests of Sony/BMG, not ours.
And you are here for our interests? Don't think so. I certainly don't
agree with much of what you say (although there are some fair points
among your long discourse).

You do realize that even people who like classical music would
probably never buy what you are interested in seeing on disc? If you
accept that premise, why would Sony or anyone else issue what you want
to see? There is no commercial reason to.

I think you are all being a bit harsh on the industry in terms of what
classical music is available. There is more interesting music
available today than ever before (especially when mp3 downloads are
included). So even if we detest them for other reasons, I'd say they
are doing something right (although, it is a fair point to say that
the major labels were not the main drivers of filling that niche, but
independent labels such as CPO, Hyperion, etc. that put together discs
on hundreds of unknown works).

If you were in this guy's position, do you think you would really be
able to have an impact as you seem to want him to have? I would
seriously doubt it.
O
2008-02-02 14:14:31 UTC
Permalink
In article
Post by u***@yahoo.com
And you are here for our interests? Don't think so. I certainly don't
agree with much of what you say (although there are some fair points
among your long discourse).
Good point.
Post by u***@yahoo.com
You do realize that even people who like classical music would
probably never buy what you are interested in seeing on disc? If you
accept that premise, why would Sony or anyone else issue what you want
to see? There is no commercial reason to.
I think you are all being a bit harsh on the industry in terms of what
classical music is available. There is more interesting music
available today than ever before (especially when mp3 downloads are
included). So even if we detest them for other reasons, I'd say they
are doing something right (although, it is a fair point to say that
the major labels were not the main drivers of filling that niche, but
independent labels such as CPO, Hyperion, etc. that put together discs
on hundreds of unknown works).
If you were in this guy's position, do you think you would really be
able to have an impact as you seem to want him to have? I would
seriously doubt it.
If you were in this guy's position, would you want to hang out in this
group just to be abused? He has to make business decisions, hard
business decisions, of which he can't make everyone happy. He's been
here soliciting our input, which is more than you can say of others.
To take this opportunity to instead zing him for the fact that he
hasn't satisfied our wants is hardly motivating for him.

-Owen
William Sommerwerck
2008-02-02 14:42:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by O
If you were in this guy's position, would you want to hang out in
this group just to be abused? He has to make business decisions,
hard business decisions, of which he can't make everyone happy.
He's been here soliciting our input, which is more than you can say
of others. To take this opportunity to instead zing him for the fact
that he hasn't satisfied our wants is hardly motivating for him.
<Amadeus>
Oh? What better motivation _should_ he be given?
</Amadeus>

Businesses make money by meeting their customers' needs and wants.

Mr. Meyers is here to learn from us, not the other way around (unless he
wants to fill us in on the gory details of the music business, which I would
very much like to hear about).
Gerard
2008-02-02 15:09:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by William Sommerwerck
Post by O
If you were in this guy's position, would you want to hang out in
this group just to be abused? He has to make business decisions,
hard business decisions, of which he can't make everyone happy.
He's been here soliciting our input, which is more than you can say
of others. To take this opportunity to instead zing him for the fact
that he hasn't satisfied our wants is hardly motivating for him.
<Amadeus>
Oh? What better motivation _should_ he be given?
</Amadeus>
Businesses make money by meeting their customers' needs and wants.
Mr. Meyers is here to learn from us, not the other way around (unless
he wants to fill us in on the gory details of the music business,
which I would very much like to hear about).
But this (those who participate in this ng) is a very selected group of
customers.
Some want to have available almost every recording ever made. But there's hardly
a business for that.
William Sommerwerck
2008-02-02 15:42:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Gerard
Post by William Sommerwerck
Mr. Meyers is here to learn from us, not the other way around (unless
he wants to fill us in on the gory details of the music business,
which I would very much like to hear about).
But this (those who participate in this ng) is a very selected group of
customers. Some want to have available almost every recording ever
made. But there's hardly a business for that.
Maybe, maybe not. It's possible, in principle, for any record label to make
every recording it ever made available as downloads. This is easy to do for
digital recordings; converting analog masters would be more difficult and
expensive.
Bob Lombard
2008-02-02 15:44:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Gerard
Post by William Sommerwerck
Post by O
If you were in this guy's position, would you want to hang out in
this group just to be abused? He has to make business decisions,
hard business decisions, of which he can't make everyone happy.
He's been here soliciting our input, which is more than you can say
of others. To take this opportunity to instead zing him for the fact
that he hasn't satisfied our wants is hardly motivating for him.
<Amadeus>
Oh? What better motivation _should_ he be given?
</Amadeus>
Businesses make money by meeting their customers' needs and wants.
Mr. Meyers is here to learn from us, not the other way around (unless
he wants to fill us in on the gory details of the music business,
which I would very much like to hear about).
But this (those who participate in this ng) is a very selected group of
customers.
Some want to have available almost every recording ever made. But there's hardly
a business for that.
--------

"Some want to have available almost every recording ever made."

It only seems that way. *Many* recordings should never have been made.
And how were participators in this ng "selected"? The majority have in
common only that they buy and listen to classical music recordings. I
suppose you could say that they are self-selected....

bl

William Sommerwerck
2008-02-02 15:26:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by u***@yahoo.com
Post by William Sommerwerck
Post by Matthew B. Tepper
So let's cut some slack for Mr. Meyers, who doesn't deserve the
open abuse that Bill has been levelling at him. Bill, count to ten
before you post!
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10
When Mr. Meyers starts actually listening to us, taking what we say
seriously, and giving thoughtful answers to our questions and requests,
then I will stop "abusing" him.
Mr. Meyers is here solely to serve the interests of Sony/BMG, not ours.
And you are here for our interests? Don't think so. I certainly don't
agree with much of what you say (although there are some fair points
among your long discourse).
You do realize that even people who like classical music would
probably never buy what you are interested in seeing on disc? If you
accept that premise, why would Sony or anyone else issue what you
want to see? There is no commercial reason to.
I've repeatedly made it clear that I'm aware of the tight financial position
much of the classical industry is in. This is mostly due to a declining
audience, but it is also due to the failure of the industry to PPPP
(properly package and promote its products).

A few years ago, if someone had suggested the idea of an SACD Living Stereo
series, what odds would you have given for its success? I wouldn't have
expected it to be the success it was, because (as far as I knew), SACD had
not made sufficient inroads to have much effect on the sales of classical
recordings (and probably still hasn't) -- and who'd buy a second copy of a
recording that had already appeared on CD, anyway?

But it _was_ a success, for precisely the reasons I listed. Sony/BMG did it
right -- new "higher-fidelity" transfers of classic performances, plus
releases of titles that hadn't yet appeared on CD, all at a reasonable
price, coupled with the kind of _promotion_ that got people lusting after
these recordings.

I can't sufficiently emphasize the need for promotion. Just because
classical music is "high art" doesn't mean it will automatically sell, or
that slick promotion will necessarily debase it. You're fighting for the
consumer's disposable income, and you have to go after it aggessively.

Now, Columbia -- at least in the stereo era -- was never known for
exceptional sound quality. * Indeed, despite RCA's attempt to take the "bad
sound" crown away with Dynagroove, Columbia was for many years the whipping
boy for bad-sounding American recordings. I am embarrassed to admit that
when I had the opportunity to ask Ben Bauer some intelligent questions, I
instead jumped down his throat and condemned Columbia's lousy sound. **

* Columbia had good sound when it wanted to. Try the "Candide" or
"Threepenny Opera" revivals of the late '70s.

** Please note that I _have_ been asking Mr. Meyer intelligent questions,
but he doesn't address them.

Columbia nevertheless has lots of outstanding (or just interesting)
performances from the multitrack era that could be profitably exploited as
hybrid SACDs incorporating both stereo and multi-ch SACD tracks to satisfy
any taste.

So why _doesn't_ Sony/BMG have a parallel series for Columbia recordings?
Why? One of the best ways to promote it would something along the lines of
"Remember those lousy-sounding Columbia LPs of great performances? Now you
can hear them the way they were supposed to sound!" In other words, turn a
lemon into lemonade.

This isn't the only way to exploit the back catalog, but -- as it mirrors
the successful Living Stereo series, and thus is likely to be successful for
the same reasons -- why isn't Sony/BMG doing it? Why?
Post by u***@yahoo.com
I think you are all being a bit harsh on the industry in terms
of what classical music is available. There is more interesting
music available today than ever before (especially when MP3
downloads are included).
No offense, but I'm an audiophile and have zero interest in
lossily-compressed audio.
Post by u***@yahoo.com
So even if we detest them for other reasons, I'd say they are
doing something right (although, it is a fair point to say that the
major labels were not the main drivers of filling that niche, but
independent labels such as CPO, Hyperion, etc. that put
together discs on hundreds of unknown works).
I don't detest Sony/BMG so much as wonder why they aren't doing the things
they need to do to successfully market the Columbia back catalog.

I also find it strange that Sony -- who created the DSD / SACD standard --
is doing so little to promote it, ESPECIALLY by issuing multi-ch SACDs of
existing multitrack recordings. Among the classical releases, you can count
those on the fingers of one hand, and still have most of your fingers left
over.
Post by u***@yahoo.com
If you were in this guy's position, do you think you would really be
able to have an impact as you seem to want him to have? I would
seriously doubt it.
Well, if he doesn't have that impact (by impact, I assume you mean
influence), why is he here? What's the point of discussing with listeners
what they want when you can't do anything about it?
William Sommerwerck
2008-02-02 00:58:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Fri, 01 Feb 2008 15:44:42 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by William Sommerwerck
Post by James Kahn
Post by William Sommerwerck
As a customer, it is indeed my place to tell any company what I
want, and how I think they should run their business. It is Sony/BMG's
obligation to, if at all possible, meet the requests of me, Mr. Tepper,
and everyone else in this group. That's why they're in business -- not
to make money, but to sell stuff people want and will purchase (of which
making money is the by-product).
I more or less agree with the first sentence, disagree with the rest.
Sony/BMG's obligation is to their shareholders, and they are in
business to make money. If you want them to do something, you'll
have to convince them that it's in their financial interest. That
doesn't
Post by Jeremy Meyers
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by William Sommerwerck
Post by James Kahn
mean they necessarily have to turn a profit on every single thing
they do, and you might argue that by engaging in certain unprofitable
activities they enhance their reputation, improve customer loyalty,
or the like. But they are certainly under no "obligation" to meet
your requests.
You'll notice I said "if at all possible". That leaves a lot of wiggle room.
Businesses that are in business only to make money, and who are more
interested in their stockholders than their customers, often
self-destruct
Post by Jeremy Meyers
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by William Sommerwerck
(qv, Enron as a recent example). Many of the problems of capitalism derive
from putting profits above everything else.
Well, I think it should be assumed that Sony puts profits above
everything else, for better or for worse, and move on from there.
Steve
"not releasing everything in our vaults in quadraphonic SACD" is not
the same as defrauding our customers. I resent the Enron comparison.
And I resent your deliberately misreading my response. And not making an
honest effort to answer my legitimate questions.

I NEVER suggested that Sony/BMG "release everything in its vaults in quad
SACD". Where did you read that? Please point to line and verse. (What I
suggested was that there should be an aggressive, heavily promoted release
of such titles from among recordings that would likely sell well. That is
NOT the same thing.)

And I've said nothing that suggests any sort of comparison between Enron and
Sony/BMG.

It's now obvious that Mr. Meyers isn't here to learn from us, but to defraud
us. He wants to squelch the people in this group by convincing us that he's
really a good guy on our side, and that we have no reason to complain about
how Sony/BMG chooses to market its products, because, really, they just
can't do any better. Though I sympathize with a company that has limited
capital in a declining market, I cannot sympathize with someone who is
deliberately trying to get us on his side, so that we'll stop complaining.
If I don't like something, why shouldn't I complain?

I don't understand why you're surprised that record buyers insist you
release recordings from your back catalog, in the formats they want. Is this
an unreasonable request? If you want me to fully sympathize with you, Mr.
Meyers, then you have to give a good reason to do. So far, you have not,
despite my repeated requests. You keep side-stepping my questions.

I really, really want Sony/BMG to be profitable and make lots of money -- if
only because it makes it possible to broaden your available catalog.

We're not your enemies, Mr. Meyers. We're your customers. But you don't seem
to understand the difference.
Matthew B. Tepper
2008-02-02 01:53:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
"not releasing everything in our vaults in quadraphonic SACD" is not
the same as defrauding our customers. I resent the Enron comparison.
While I regard the music industry in general as having a fundamentally
diseased corporate culture at certain levels of management, I see no such
parallel between Enron and Sony BMG. If anything, the parallel I would draw
would be between Dennis Kozlowski and certain of his associates at Tyco
International and recent revelations about high-spending executives at EMI.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
War is Peace. ** Freedom is Slavery. ** It's all Napster's fault!
Steve de Mena
2008-02-02 02:56:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Matthew B. Tepper
Post by Jeremy Meyers
"not releasing everything in our vaults in quadraphonic SACD" is not
the same as defrauding our customers. I resent the Enron comparison.
While I regard the music industry in general as having a fundamentally
diseased corporate culture at certain levels of management, I see no such
parallel between Enron and Sony BMG. If anything, the parallel I would draw
would be between Dennis Kozlowski and certain of his associates at Tyco
International and recent revelations about high-spending executives at EMI.
You mean the EMI execs who spent lavishly on their top artists, so
they would be happy and stay at the label to make further hits (and
money) for everyone? I saw nothing wrong with that.

Steve
j***@aol.com
2008-02-02 03:20:32 UTC
Permalink
I know it was said previously in this thread, but to reiterate:

*** None of the Szell SA-CDs are playable in ordinary CD players!! ***

I'm sure if they were reissued in hybrid format, they would sell a lot
more.
Matthew B. Tepper
2008-01-31 15:47:12 UTC
Permalink
and now you can get samples of every track from all of our albums on our
website for free... a better deal than a $2 album of bleeding chunks, no?
You state this proudly, and I won't argue, but you do realize I hope that
this is an example of the industry following consumer demand only after a
very, very long time of declining to even acknowledge that demand, let alone
respond to it. I loathe coffee, but if I were stranded, cold, and thirsty,
and coffee was all that there was to drink, I would drink it.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
War is Peace. ** Freedom is Slavery. ** It's all Napster's fault!
Jeremy Meyers
2008-01-31 18:07:10 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 15:47:12 -0000, "Matthew B. Tepper"
Post by Matthew B. Tepper
and now you can get samples of every track from all of our albums on our
website for free... a better deal than a $2 album of bleeding chunks, no?
You state this proudly, and I won't argue, but you do realize I hope that
this is an example of the industry following consumer demand only after a
very, very long time of declining to even acknowledge that demand, let alone
respond to it. I loathe coffee, but if I were stranded, cold, and thirsty,
and coffee was all that there was to drink, I would drink it.
i will not accept reponsibility for the failures of the music industry
from before i was born. One of the first things i did when i came
here was implement sound samples.

j

--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
e: ***@sonybmg.com
Matthew B. Tepper
2008-01-31 20:39:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 15:47:12 -0000, "Matthew B. Tepper"
Post by Matthew B. Tepper
Post by Jeremy Meyers
and now you can get samples of every track from all of our albums on
our website for free... a better deal than a $2 album of bleeding
chunks, no?
You state this proudly, and I won't argue, but you do realize I hope
that this is an example of the industry following consumer demand only
after a very, very long time of declining to even acknowledge that
demand, let alone respond to it. I loathe coffee, but if I were
stranded, cold, and thirsty, and coffee was all that there was to drink,
I would drink it.
i will not accept reponsibility for the failures of the music industry
from before i was born.
Since the blame is not yours, I do not expect you to do so. I merely point
out that the history of the industry before your time (and even before
mine) has not tended to be one of welcoming change.
Post by Jeremy Meyers
One of the first things i did when i came here was implement sound
samples.
And you were absolutely right to do so.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
War is Peace. ** Freedom is Slavery. ** It's all Napster's fault!
Jeremy Meyers
2008-01-31 18:07:46 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 15:47:12 -0000, "Matthew B. Tepper"
Post by Matthew B. Tepper
and now you can get samples of every track from all of our albums on our
website for free... a better deal than a $2 album of bleeding chunks, no?
You state this proudly, and I won't argue, but you do realize I hope that
this is an example of the industry following consumer demand only after a
very, very long time of declining to even acknowledge that demand, let alone
respond to it. I loathe coffee, but if I were stranded, cold, and thirsty,
and coffee was all that there was to drink, I would drink it.
and actually i would say that compared to, say, the coffee industry,
the music business is much quicker to adapt to consumer demands.

it's a matter of scale.

j

--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
e: ***@sonybmg.com
Matthew B. Tepper
2008-01-31 20:39:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
and actually i would say that compared to, say, the coffee industry,
the music business is much quicker to adapt to consumer demands.
it's a matter of scale.
I don't follow the coffee industry, for obvious reasons, but it seems to me
that chains such as Starbucks, Seattle's Best Coffee, and the like have
been extremely quick and flexible in reacting to customer's needs and sales
trends. Those are qualities I would not ascribe to the music business, and
I'm frankly curious as to why you think so.

Even given my dislike of coffee, I'm intrigued at the coming confluence of
the two industries with the iPhone (yes, I have one). I patronize a Robeks
(it's a juice bar chain, for our outside-USA contributors) right next to a
Starbucks, so I'll be interested to see how the technology works when it
comes here to L.A.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
War is Peace. ** Freedom is Slavery. ** It's all Napster's fault!
Steve de Mena
2008-01-31 20:59:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Matthew B. Tepper
Post by Jeremy Meyers
and actually i would say that compared to, say, the coffee industry,
the music business is much quicker to adapt to consumer demands.
it's a matter of scale.
I don't follow the coffee industry, for obvious reasons, but it seems to me
that chains such as Starbucks, Seattle's Best Coffee, and the like have
been extremely quick and flexible in reacting to customer's needs and sales
trends.
Really? I don't think was a coffee "need" before those two chains
came along.

Steve
Bob Lombard
2008-01-31 21:20:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Matthew B. Tepper
Post by Jeremy Meyers
and actually i would say that compared to, say, the coffee industry,
the music business is much quicker to adapt to consumer demands.
it's a matter of scale.
I don't follow the coffee industry, for obvious reasons, but it seems
to me that chains such as Starbucks, Seattle's Best Coffee, and the
like have been extremely quick and flexible in reacting to customer's
needs and sales trends.
Really? I don't think was a coffee "need" before those two chains came
along.
Steve
---------
You guys are leaving out Dunkin' Donuts, they're big in coffee now.
Makes some sense too; one 'needs' coffee to wash down them thar donuts.

bl
Norman M. Schwartz
2008-01-31 23:24:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Matthew B. Tepper
Post by Jeremy Meyers
and actually i would say that compared to, say, the coffee industry,
the music business is much quicker to adapt to consumer demands.
it's a matter of scale.
I don't follow the coffee industry, for obvious reasons, but it seems to
me that chains such as Starbucks, Seattle's Best Coffee, and the like
have been extremely quick and flexible in reacting to customer's needs
and sales trends.
Really? I don't think was a coffee "need" before those two chains came
along.
Huh?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coffeehouse
Steve
Steve de Mena
2008-02-01 00:47:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Norman M. Schwartz
Post by Matthew B. Tepper
Post by Jeremy Meyers
and actually i would say that compared to, say, the coffee industry,
the music business is much quicker to adapt to consumer demands.
it's a matter of scale.
I don't follow the coffee industry, for obvious reasons, but it seems to
me that chains such as Starbucks, Seattle's Best Coffee, and the like
have been extremely quick and flexible in reacting to customer's needs
and sales trends.
Really? I don't think was a coffee "need" before those two chains came
along.
Huh?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coffeehouse
What I meant is we didn't have them on every corner like we do today.

Steve
Norman M. Schwartz
2008-02-01 14:20:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by Norman M. Schwartz
Really? I don't think was a coffee "need" before those two chains came
along.
Huh?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coffeehouse
What I meant is we didn't have them on every corner like we do today.
Sometimes I "need" a Starbucks on every corner. Tell me how else you are
going to find a rest room on every corner?
Post by Steve de Mena
Steve
Matthew B. Tepper
2008-02-01 15:35:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by Norman M. Schwartz
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by Matthew B. Tepper
Post by Jeremy Meyers
and actually i would say that compared to, say, the coffee industry,
the music business is much quicker to adapt to consumer demands.
it's a matter of scale.
I don't follow the coffee industry, for obvious reasons, but it seems
to me that chains such as Starbucks, Seattle's Best Coffee, and the
like have been extremely quick and flexible in reacting to customer's
needs and sales trends.
Really? I don't think was a coffee "need" before those two chains
came along.
Huh?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coffeehouse
What I meant is we didn't have them on every corner like we do today.
In the '80s, it was frozen yogurt.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
War is Peace. ** Freedom is Slavery. ** It's all Napster's fault!
Edward A. Cowan
2008-02-01 01:41:29 UTC
Permalink
By the late 19th century, the Viennese coffeehouse was a major venue
for social interaction, especially by the artistic and literary sets.
And in Vienna around this time, one of them, the Café Griensteidl, in
the Michaelerplatz, was a favorite haunt for luminaries such as
Hofmannsthal, Schnitzler, Hermann Bahr, and others. It was torn down
during the time of the architectural renovation of Vienna, but in the
late 20th century it was restored (sort of) under its old name. I used
to patronize it during my two-week stay in Vienna in the summer of
1995, chiefly because of its literary associations. As in the old
k.u.k. time ("Kaiserlich und Königlich"), the latter day Griensteidl
offers, in addition to food and coffee, many international newspapers
and even a Brockhaus encyclopedia. (That was then, and this is now, of
course. I should imagine that the "new" Griensteidl would have web
access and other latter day technological amenities...) --E.A.C.
Post by Matthew B. Tepper
Post by Jeremy Meyers
and actually i would say that compared to, say, the coffee industry,
the music business is much quicker to adapt to consumer demands.
it's a matter of scale.
I don't follow the coffee industry, for obvious reasons, but it seems to
me that chains such as Starbucks, Seattle's Best Coffee, and the like
have been extremely quick and flexible in reacting to customer's needs
and sales trends.
Really? I don't think was a coffee "need" before those two chains came
along.
Huh?http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coffeehouse
Steve
j***@aol.com
2008-02-01 02:27:15 UTC
Permalink
Let me chime in and say that I loved both of the Szell "Original
Jackets" editions. I'm also really interested in the Szell recordings
that, thus far, are only available on SA-CD. I don't have a player
for Super Audio, and would never buy one just to listen to those CDs.
I can see why Sony issued them only in that format to encourage
adoption - but at this point?

I think the model that DG has of providing rare recordings as
downloads on their site is a good one, but I still like to be able to
hold a handsome package in my hand, so there is a place for both ways
of selling music. I bought several of the Heritage CDs since I liked
so much the packaging and the annotations. I'd love to see a deluxe
"Szell Rarities" box. There is plenty that never made it to CD - at
least not from CBS or Sony.
Jeremy Meyers
2008-02-01 09:52:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by j***@aol.com
Let me chime in and say that I loved both of the Szell "Original
Jackets" editions. I'm also really interested in the Szell recordings
that, thus far, are only available on SA-CD. I don't have a player
for Super Audio, and would never buy one just to listen to those CDs.
I can see why Sony issued them only in that format to encourage
adoption - but at this point?
every SACD we've put out since around 2000 has been in the SACD Hybrid
format, playable (in stereo) on non-SACD players.
Post by j***@aol.com
I think the model that DG has of providing rare recordings as
downloads on their site is a good one, but I still like to be able to
hold a handsome package in my hand, so there is a place for both ways
of selling music. I bought several of the Heritage CDs since I liked
so much the packaging and the annotations. I'd love to see a deluxe
"Szell Rarities" box. There is plenty that never made it to CD - at
least not from CBS or Sony.
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
e: ***@sonybmg.com
William Sommerwerck
2008-02-01 15:25:36 UTC
Permalink
Every SACD we've put out since around 2000 has been in the SACD
Hybrid format, playable (in stereo) on non-SACD players.
You're mistaken.
Matthew B. Tepper
2008-01-31 15:47:11 UTC
Permalink
No, but not every person who hears beethoven + brahms turns into a lifelong
classical devotee. There are some who own 5 or 6 recordings, and maybe are
interested in more.
There are levels of fandom, it's not binary.
True. And not merely levels, but types or styles. The only woman collector
I've ever known had several hundred LPs (this was back in the 1970s), but she
tended to have only one or two recordings of particular works, just quite a
few works to begin with.

Question for you: Is part of Sony BMG's sales emphasis given over to
developing the one-or-two-times buyers into many-times buyers, just
increasing the number of one-time buyers? Or both, or something else?
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
War is Peace. ** Freedom is Slavery. ** It's all Napster's fault!
Todd Schurk
2008-01-31 16:32:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 22:59:48 -0800 (PST), Todd Schurk
Post by Todd Schurk
Post by Todd Schurk
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 19:06:03 -0800 (PST), Todd Schurk
Post by Todd Schurk
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring. I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
I wish you would honor a true Columbia/Sony/Bmg artist while he is
living with a comparable edition-one Leon Fleisher...and I don't
consider that disgrace of bleeding hunks that was just issued as an
"honor"...really-the "scherzo" of the Brahms Piano Quintet-absurd, but
telling at the same time. Disgusting. Todd S.
I would argue that you, Sir, were not at all the target audience for
The Essential Leon Fleisher. Would you rather we not provide a way
for a neophyte to get into " a true artist"s recorded works, and
instead only leave it to people who already know allabout his recorded
works?? I would say that that is the absurd position.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
Well, perhaps you might consider offering some intelligent and long
overdue packaging of neglected catalog (and I'm not just writing about
the estimable Fleisher) to your non-neophyte target audience-
yes,that's right-the people who have been buying Columbia/Sony/Bmg
classical for 35,45,50, years or more. Or do we not matter enough to
get an artist playing a complete work? Lame, Dude.
Oh...and one more thing, I (and I guess a few others) was once that
"neophyte" and found my way just fine through a whole Beethoven
symphony or a complete Brahms Quintet. Are newbies to "classical"
music these days less able than we were? Todd S.
No, but not every person who hears beethoven + brahms turns into a
lifelong classical devotee. There are some who own 5 or 6 recordings,
and maybe are interested in more.
There are levels of fandom, it's not binary.
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
If you are aiming for the younger neophyte to into him/her to
classical music-and still want to keep/satisfy your loyal older
collectors-would it not make more sense to reverse the idea-put the
excerpt of the Brahms on the download site and the complete version in
the hard copy cd for the collector who has waited paitiently for 30 or
so years for a cd issue? Todd S. p.s. I'm certainly grateful for
some of the very positive issues and reissues-I own both Szell
Original Jacket boxes and find then excellent...so I still have faith.
T.
Tony
2008-01-31 06:59:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 19:06:03 -0800 (PST), Todd Schurk
Post by Todd Schurk
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring.  I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
I wish you would honor a true Columbia/Sony/Bmg artist while he is
living with a comparable edition-one Leon Fleisher...and I don't
consider that disgrace of bleeding hunks that was just issued as an
"honor"...really-the "scherzo" of the Brahms Piano Quintet-absurd, but
telling at the same time. Disgusting. Todd S.
I would argue that you, Sir, were not at all the target audience for
The Essential Leon Fleisher.  Would you rather we not provide a way
for a neophyte to get into " a true artist"s recorded works, and
instead only leave it to people who already know allabout his recorded
works??  I would say that that is the absurd position.
But Jeremy, you can't have it both ways. Compilations of select
movements from various works are fine for the target neophyte audience
you mention, but at the same time, the Essential Leon Fleisher CD
announces as its selling point that this is the first CD release of
the Scherzo from the Brahms Piano Quintet. I very much doubt that the
target audience, as you put it, truly cares about that discographical
detail. So why bother? If that tagline was thrown in there to get the
interest of us collectors, then it's a petty thing to do, and actually
quite annoying to be teased with 1/4 of a great performance many
people have been waiting to see on CD for years. Don't tease me, bro!
When I saw the tagline I felt like I was shopping for a new car, and
in the lot I see an undesirable used car for sale with a sign saying
that one of the features of this used car is that it has 1 brand new
tire.

Incidentally, the compilation of excerpts route is not the only way to
go with target neophyte audiences. The Great Pianists and Great
Conductors managed quite nicely to present effective cross sections of
each artist in each 2-cd set without resorting to bleeding chunks.

Jeremy, can you answer my Glenn Gould edition/live recitals question?
Pretty please? They will sell, and sell well.

cheers,
Tony
Steve de Mena
2008-01-31 08:47:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tony
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 19:06:03 -0800 (PST), Todd Schurk
Post by Todd Schurk
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring. I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
I wish you would honor a true Columbia/Sony/Bmg artist while he is
living with a comparable edition-one Leon Fleisher...and I don't
consider that disgrace of bleeding hunks that was just issued as an
"honor"...really-the "scherzo" of the Brahms Piano Quintet-absurd, but
telling at the same time. Disgusting. Todd S.
I would argue that you, Sir, were not at all the target audience for
The Essential Leon Fleisher. Would you rather we not provide a way
for a neophyte to get into " a true artist"s recorded works, and
instead only leave it to people who already know allabout his recorded
works?? I would say that that is the absurd position.
But Jeremy, you can't have it both ways. Compilations of select
movements from various works are fine for the target neophyte audience
you mention, but at the same time, the Essential Leon Fleisher CD
announces as its selling point that this is the first CD release of
the Scherzo from the Brahms Piano Quintet. I very much doubt that the
target audience, as you put it, truly cares about that discographical
detail. So why bother?
The complete Piano Quintet is available on the iTunes version.
Hopefully it will also appear in the higher quality and DRM free
Amazon MP3.

Steve
Tony
2008-02-01 04:43:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by Tony
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 19:06:03 -0800 (PST), Todd Schurk
Post by Todd Schurk
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring.  I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
I wish you would honor a true Columbia/Sony/Bmg artist while he is
living with a comparable edition-one Leon Fleisher...and I don't
consider that disgrace of bleeding hunks that was just issued as an
"honor"...really-the "scherzo" of the Brahms Piano Quintet-absurd, but
telling at the same time. Disgusting. Todd S.
I would argue that you, Sir, were not at all the target audience for
The Essential Leon Fleisher.  Would you rather we not provide a way
for a neophyte to get into " a true artist"s recorded works, and
instead only leave it to people who already know allabout his recorded
works??  I would say that that is the absurd position.
But Jeremy, you can't have it both ways. Compilations of select
movements from various works are fine for the target neophyte audience
you mention, but at the same time, the Essential Leon Fleisher CD
announces as its selling point that this is the first CD release of
the Scherzo from the Brahms Piano Quintet.  I very much doubt that the
target audience, as you put it, truly cares about that discographical
detail. So why bother?  
The complete Piano Quintet is available on the iTunes version.
Hopefully it will also appear in the higher quality and DRM free
Amazon MP3.
True, but I prefer normal, pressed CDs with the booklet and
everything. I don't think that's unreasonable. Also, commercial CD-Rs
like Arkiv's and digital downloads have no resale value (which is
something I'm sure the record companies prefer).

cheers,
Tony
Jeremy Meyers
2008-01-31 13:27:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tony
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 19:06:03 -0800 (PST), Todd Schurk
Post by Todd Schurk
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring.  I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
I wish you would honor a true Columbia/Sony/Bmg artist while he is
living with a comparable edition-one Leon Fleisher...and I don't
consider that disgrace of bleeding hunks that was just issued as an
"honor"...really-the "scherzo" of the Brahms Piano Quintet-absurd, but
telling at the same time. Disgusting. Todd S.
I would argue that you, Sir, were not at all the target audience for
The Essential Leon Fleisher.  Would you rather we not provide a way
for a neophyte to get into " a true artist"s recorded works, and
instead only leave it to people who already know allabout his recorded
works??  I would say that that is the absurd position.
But Jeremy, you can't have it both ways. Compilations of select
movements from various works are fine for the target neophyte audience
you mention, but at the same time, the Essential Leon Fleisher CD
announces as its selling point that this is the first CD release of
the Scherzo from the Brahms Piano Quintet. I very much doubt that the
target audience, as you put it, truly cares about that discographical
detail. So why bother? If that tagline was thrown in there to get the
interest of us collectors, then it's a petty thing to do, and actually
quite annoying to be teased with 1/4 of a great performance many
people have been waiting to see on CD for years. Don't tease me, bro!
When I saw the tagline I felt like I was shopping for a new car, and
in the lot I see an undesirable used car for sale with a sign saying
that one of the features of this used car is that it has 1 brand new
tire.
theres only so much room on the CD. the full version is on iTunes
Post by Tony
Incidentally, the compilation of excerpts route is not the only way to
go with target neophyte audiences. The Great Pianists and Great
Conductors managed quite nicely to present effective cross sections of
each artist in each 2-cd set without resorting to bleeding chunks.
Jeremy, can you answer my Glenn Gould edition/live recitals question?
Pretty please? They will sell, and sell well.
passed this along to a&r
Post by Tony
cheers,
Tony
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
e: ***@sonybmg.com
Tony
2008-02-01 04:51:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tony
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 19:06:03 -0800 (PST), Todd Schurk
Post by Todd Schurk
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring.  I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
I wish you would honor a true Columbia/Sony/Bmg artist while he is
living with a comparable edition-one Leon Fleisher...and I don't
consider that disgrace of bleeding hunks that was just issued as an
"honor"...really-the "scherzo" of the Brahms Piano Quintet-absurd, but
telling at the same time. Disgusting. Todd S.
I would argue that you, Sir, were not at all the target audience for
The Essential Leon Fleisher.  Would you rather we not provide a way
for a neophyte to get into " a true artist"s recorded works, and
instead only leave it to people who already know allabout his recorded
works??  I would say that that is the absurd position.
But Jeremy, you can't have it both ways. Compilations of select
movements from various works are fine for the target neophyte audience
you mention, but at the same time, the Essential Leon Fleisher CD
announces as its selling point that this is the first CD release of
the Scherzo from the Brahms Piano Quintet.  I very much doubt that the
target audience, as you put it, truly cares about that discographical
detail. So why bother?  If that tagline was thrown in there to get the
interest of us collectors, then it's a petty thing to do, and actually
quite annoying to be teased with 1/4 of a great performance many
people have been waiting to see on CD for years. Don't tease me, bro!
When I saw the tagline I felt like I was shopping for a new car, and
in the lot I see an undesirable used car for sale with a sign saying
that one of the features of this used car is that it has 1 brand new
tire.
theres only so much room on the CD.   the full version is on iTunes
Yes, I know. I wasn't suggesting that the compilation CD necessarily
contain the entire performance, but the teaser line on that
compilation CD was unnecessary, as it would make no difference to the
target novice audience that this was the Scherzo's first CD
appearance, while at the same time annoying serious CD collectors that
the rest is not available on CD. I know a lot of people do iTunes, but
a lot of the classical collectors don't, either because they are not
into the technology or are just purists about wanting a real album.
Post by Tony
Incidentally, the compilation of excerpts route is not the only way to
go with target neophyte audiences. The Great Pianists and Great
Conductors managed quite nicely to present effective cross sections of
each artist in each 2-cd set without resorting to bleeding chunks.
Jeremy, can you answer my Glenn Gould edition/live recitals question?
Pretty please?  They will sell, and sell well.
passed this along to a&r
Cool. I have brought this up with others at Sony in the 90s, they
assured me that these live concerts were on the radar. But the last
new releases in the Glenn Gould Edition were in 1997, 3 CDs worth of
material mostly new to CD (and getting their first official release).
Since then, we have obviously been inundated with multple iterations
of the same old Gould material, some of it in very nice packaging, but
that seems like a waste of resources.

cheers,
Tony
Steve de Mena
2008-02-01 07:07:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tony
Post by Jeremy Meyers
Post by Tony
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 19:06:03 -0800 (PST), Todd Schurk
Post by Todd Schurk
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring. I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
I wish you would honor a true Columbia/Sony/Bmg artist while he is
living with a comparable edition-one Leon Fleisher...and I don't
consider that disgrace of bleeding hunks that was just issued as an
"honor"...really-the "scherzo" of the Brahms Piano Quintet-absurd, but
telling at the same time. Disgusting. Todd S.
I would argue that you, Sir, were not at all the target audience for
The Essential Leon Fleisher. Would you rather we not provide a way
for a neophyte to get into " a true artist"s recorded works, and
instead only leave it to people who already know allabout his recorded
works?? I would say that that is the absurd position.
But Jeremy, you can't have it both ways. Compilations of select
movements from various works are fine for the target neophyte audience
you mention, but at the same time, the Essential Leon Fleisher CD
announces as its selling point that this is the first CD release of
the Scherzo from the Brahms Piano Quintet. I very much doubt that the
target audience, as you put it, truly cares about that discographical
detail. So why bother? If that tagline was thrown in there to get the
interest of us collectors, then it's a petty thing to do, and actually
quite annoying to be teased with 1/4 of a great performance many
people have been waiting to see on CD for years. Don't tease me, bro!
When I saw the tagline I felt like I was shopping for a new car, and
in the lot I see an undesirable used car for sale with a sign saying
that one of the features of this used car is that it has 1 brand new
tire.
theres only so much room on the CD. the full version is on iTunes
Yes, I know. I wasn't suggesting that the compilation CD necessarily
contain the entire performance, but the teaser line on that
compilation CD was unnecessary, as it would make no difference to the
target novice audience that this was the Scherzo's first CD
appearance, while at the same time annoying serious CD collectors that
the rest is not available on CD. I know a lot of people do iTunes, but
a lot of the classical collectors don't, either because they are not
into the technology or are just purists about wanting a real album.
Is that why iTunes has a higher percentage of Classical sales,
something like 12% (quoted in the NY Times and other places back in
2006), versus 3% for physical CDs? I think you are translating your
personal preferences as being the norm.

Steve
William Sommerwerck
2008-01-31 12:23:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
I would argue that you, Sir, were not at all the target audience for
The Essential Leon Fleisher. Would you rather we not provide a
way for a neophyte to get into "a true artist"s recorded works, and
instead only leave it to people who already know allabout his recorded
works? I would say that that is the absurd position.
I would argue (as I have so often in the past) that, if something is cheap
enough, people will buy it.

I'm a listener of 40+ years' standing, but that didn't keep me from
purchasing the Brilliant Mozart and Beethoven sets. You need to appeal to
people's desire to "consume mass quantities" -- or just to hear something
different. The only Heritage disks I bought were those I got for $2 from
BMG. (Liked 'em all, by the way.)

In fairness, low price = inexpensive packaging + few, if any, extras. The
fancy packaging for the Rubinstein set probably cost more than the CDs.
Sturdy cases with lavish liner notes are nice, but the latter could just as
easily be provided on a bonus CD ROM.
Bob Lombard
2008-01-31 13:02:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by William Sommerwerck
Post by Jeremy Meyers
I would argue that you, Sir, were not at all the target audience for
The Essential Leon Fleisher. Would you rather we not provide a
way for a neophyte to get into "a true artist"s recorded works, and
instead only leave it to people who already know allabout his recorded
works? I would say that that is the absurd position.
I would argue (as I have so often in the past) that, if something is cheap
enough, people will buy it.
I'm a listener of 40+ years' standing, but that didn't keep me from
purchasing the Brilliant Mozart and Beethoven sets. You need to appeal to
people's desire to "consume mass quantities" -- or just to hear something
different. The only Heritage disks I bought were those I got for $2 from
BMG. (Liked 'em all, by the way.)
In fairness, low price = inexpensive packaging + few, if any, extras. The
fancy packaging for the Rubinstein set probably cost more than the CDs.
Sturdy cases with lavish liner notes are nice, but the latter could just as
easily be provided on a bonus CD ROM.
Fancy packaging of overpriced CD sets is analogous to leather bound
book sets; their appeal is to the 'high noses'.

bl
Matthew B. Tepper
2008-01-31 15:47:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bob Lombard
Post by William Sommerwerck
I would argue that you, Sir, were not at all the target audience for The
Essential Leon Fleisher. Would you rather we not provide a way for a
neophyte to get into "a true artist"s recorded works, and instead only
leave it to people who already know allabout his recorded works? I would
say that that is the absurd position.
I would argue (as I have so often in the past) that, if something is
cheap enough, people will buy it.
I'm a listener of 40+ years' standing, but that didn't keep me from
purchasing the Brilliant Mozart and Beethoven sets. You need to appeal
to people's desire to "consume mass quantities" -- or just to hear
something different. The only Heritage disks I bought were those I got
for $2 from BMG. (Liked 'em all, by the way.)
In fairness, low price = inexpensive packaging + few, if any, extras.
The fancy packaging for the Rubinstein set probably cost more than the
CDs. Sturdy cases with lavish liner notes are nice, but the latter
could just as easily be provided on a bonus CD ROM.
Fancy packaging of overpriced CD sets is analogous to leather bound
book sets; their appeal is to the 'high noses'.
Before he completely settled into his successful career as a writer and
editor of science fiction, Frederik Pohl worked at many jobs, including that
of an advertising executive. In his book _The Way the Future Was_ he tells
one story of how a client had an overstock of coffeetable books (I forget on
which subjects) that they wanted to move. Pohl was put in charge of testing
the various advertising taglines in direct mail, and of course he tried
several appealing to consumers on the basis of their intelligence, their
interest in one-upping the neighbors, having something the kiddies could
learn from, and so on. To his shock, the advertising line which worked the
best was, "Do you have a big bookshelf? If so, we have a BIG BOOK FOR YOU!"
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
War is Peace. ** Freedom is Slavery. ** It's all Napster's fault!
Tony
2008-01-31 03:53:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring.  I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
Hopefully it won't be one concerto per CD like the early Original
Jacket sets. I know the Original Jacket collections are all about
nostalgia and novelty, and in some cases include some tracks that are
new to CD, but if Sony really wants to cash in on people's nostalgia,
how about some releases from the vaults that would be entirely new to
CD?

Speaking of Complete sets. Incidentally, I asked this before but
never got an answer. Lately Sony has been releasing multiple
iterations of Glenn Gould's existing catalogue (even more egregiously
than before), yet the original Sony Glenn Gould Edition promised live
recordings from concerts in Buffalo, Baltimore, etc. (a couple of
which appeared on the quickly suppressed Music and Arts CDs many, many
years ago), but these have never been released. Glenn Gould
recordings are likely one of Sony Classical's biggest and most
enduring sellers, and he is one of the few brand names in classical
music with some popular appeal, it seems obvious that these live
recordings Sony once promised us ought to be released, it makes sense
for collectors and for Sony. This may be out of your jurisdiction,
but can you help make this happen, Jeremy?

cheers,
Tony
Matthew B. Tepper
2008-01-31 05:27:36 UTC
Permalink
Tony <***@gmail.com> appears to have caused the following letters to be
typed in news:8389e4a7-d7fa-48ae-8484-
Lately Sony has been releasing multiple iterations of Glenn Gould's
existing catalogue (even more egregiously than before),
You mean I'm not the only one who has noticed that?
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
War is Peace. ** Freedom is Slavery. ** It's all Napster's fault!
u***@jimmytseng.net
2008-01-31 11:02:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tony
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring.  I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
Hopefully it won't be one concerto per CD like the early Original
Jacket sets.  I know the Original Jacket collections are all about
nostalgia and novelty, and in some cases include some tracks that are
new to CD, but if Sony really wants to cash in on people's nostalgia,
how about some releases from the vaults that would be entirely new to
CD?
Speaking of Complete sets.  Incidentally, I asked this before but
never got an answer. Lately Sony has been releasing multiple
iterations of Glenn Gould's existing catalogue (even more egregiously
than before), yet the original Sony Glenn Gould Edition promised live
recordings from concerts in Buffalo, Baltimore, etc. (a couple of
which appeared on the quickly suppressed Music and Arts CDs many, many
years ago), but these have never been released.  Glenn Gould
recordings are likely one of Sony Classical's biggest and most
enduring sellers, and he is one of the few brand names in classical
music with some popular appeal, it seems obvious that these live
recordings Sony once promised us ought to be released, it makes sense
for collectors and for Sony.  This may be out of your jurisdiction,
but can you help make this happen, Jeremy?
cheers,
Tony- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
I actually like the fact that the concertos are separate on the CDs. I
don't mind at all with the larger number of CDs.

Agree though with getting the live recordings of Glenn Gould out.
Though I would believe that's probably not that high on Sony's
priorities?
Al Eisner
2008-02-02 00:54:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tony
Post by Jeremy Meyers
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring.  I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
Hopefully it won't be one concerto per CD like the early Original
Jacket sets. I know the Original Jacket collections are all about
nostalgia and novelty, and in some cases include some tracks that are
new to CD, but if Sony really wants to cash in on people's nostalgia,
how about some releases from the vaults that would be entirely new to
CD?
The Szell Mozart original jackets set did add mono recordings of
symphonies 38-40 and a few shorter items which, I think, hadn't
previously been on CD. Thus for some (not all) of the CDs they
did take advantage of the greater time available to a CD.
--
Al Eisner
San Mateo Co., CA
Tony
2008-02-02 02:41:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Al Eisner
Post by Tony
Post by Jeremy Meyers
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring.  I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
Hopefully it won't be one concerto per CD like the early Original
Jacket sets.  I know the Original Jacket collections are all about
nostalgia and novelty, and in some cases include some tracks that are
new to CD, but if Sony really wants to cash in on people's nostalgia,
how about some releases from the vaults that would be entirely new to
CD?
The Szell Mozart original jackets set did add mono recordings of
symphonies 38-40 and a few shorter items which, I think, hadn't
previously been on CD.  Thus for some (not all) of the CDs they
did take advantage of the greater time available to a CD.
True, but that's why I referred to the "early Original Jackets" sets,
which all timed in at the original LP playing time per CD. Such as the
Bernstein set. The Szell set is one of the most recent Original Jacket
sets, and does take better advantage of the CD playing times.

cheers,
Tony
Steve de Mena
2008-01-31 04:10:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring. I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
j
Thanks. I am also hoping to see an impressive selection of classical
Sony/BMG titles on the Amazon MP3 service, as I have read Sony has
made an agreement with Amazon.

Deutsche Grammophon has over 600 out of print titles in their download
webshop (320 kbps MP3s) and I know you can beat that number! Then
when all of the OOP titles are online it would be nice to see
never-on-CD titles.

Steve
Jeremy Meyers
2008-01-31 04:50:48 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 20:10:07 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring. I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
j
Thanks. I am also hoping to see an impressive selection of classical
Sony/BMG titles on the Amazon MP3 service, as I have read Sony has
made an agreement with Amazon.
Deutsche Grammophon has over 600 out of print titles in their download
webshop (320 kbps MP3s) and I know you can beat that number! Then
when all of the OOP titles are online it would be nice to see
never-on-CD titles.
Steve
check arkiv for OOP masterworks stuff
and yes i see your point

but truth be told, there are titles that are in-print that are not
available on amazon or itunes. our top priority is those before we
get to OOP stuff. however, the OOP stuff we DO get to appears on
Arkiv and Testament

j

--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
e: ***@sonybmg.com
Steve de Mena
2008-01-31 05:23:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 20:10:07 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by Jeremy Meyers
On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 16:34:52 -0800, Steve de Mena
Post by Steve de Mena
Post by u***@jimmytseng.net
Do any of you know if RCA will reissue the complete Rubinstein
edition? I didn't have the finances back then, and now I sort of
regret not holding up a bank to finance me. (Just kidding...)
I would be happy to buy it either in the full set (with all the
decorations and books) or just the CDs with the information.
As well, are there any other interesting box sets worth looking at?
I would like to see the complete Heifetz Collection reissued.
But I doubt either of us will get our wish, at least not on physical CDs.
Steve
We're putting out a 10-CD Heifetz Original Jackets collection later
this spring. I dont have the list on me but i will post tomorrow.
j
Thanks. I am also hoping to see an impressive selection of classical
Sony/BMG titles on the Amazon MP3 service, as I have read Sony has
made an agreement with Amazon.
Deutsche Grammophon has over 600 out of print titles in their download
webshop (320 kbps MP3s) and I know you can beat that number! Then
when all of the OOP titles are online it would be nice to see
never-on-CD titles.
Steve
check arkiv for OOP masterworks stuff
and yes i see your point
but truth be told, there are titles that are in-print that are not
available on amazon or itunes. our top priority is those before we
get to OOP stuff. however, the OOP stuff we DO get to appears on
Arkiv and Testament
j
--
Jeremy Meyers
Manager, Digital Sales and Editorial
SONY BMG Masterworks / SONY BMG Commercial Music Group
550 Madison Avenue #1622, NYC 10022
I see hundreds of Sony/BMG titles showed up today on Amazon MP3
downloads. Nice start.

I do checkout ArkivMusic pretty frequently to see their new ArkivCD
reissues.

Thanks.

Steve
Matthew B. Tepper
2008-01-31 05:27:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Meyers
but truth be told, there are titles that are in-print that are not
available on amazon or itunes. our top priority is those before we
get to OOP stuff. however, the OOP stuff we DO get to appears on
Arkiv and Testament
Allow me to utter a four-letter word:

Ives!
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
War is Peace. ** Freedom is Slavery. ** It's all Napster's fault!
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