Fav Mozart PC recordings

[JudeoN4zi]

KV 365; Gilels/Gilels
KV 382; Bashkirov
KV 453, Bashkirov
KV 467; Anda
KV 595; Gilels

About these I'm more or less sure... just out of my head... probably Pletnev also... maybe Richter in 482... no Schnabel probably as he is too hurried...

[DeepBlue]

Post by JudeoN4zi
KV 365; Gilels/Gilels
KV 382; Bashkirov
KV 453, Bashkirov
KV 467; Anda
KV 595; Gilels

Not bad choices overall.

What about 466? 482?
488? 491? 503? 537?

Thx

[JudeoN4zi]

Post by DeepBlue

Post by JudeoN4zi
KV 365; Gilels/Gilels
KV 382; Bashkirov
KV 453, Bashkirov
KV 467; Anda
KV 595; Gilels

Not bad choices overall.
What about 466? 482?
488? 491? 503? 537?

The Serkins in all the rest ;)

Post by DeepBlue
Thx

[JudeoN4zi]

Post by DeepBlue

Post by JudeoN4zi
KV 365; Gilels/Gilels
KV 382; Bashkirov
KV 453, Bashkirov
KV 467; Anda
KV 595; Gilels

Not bad choices overall.
What about 466? 482?
488? 491? 503? 537?

In 488 probably Horowitz… in 482… hmm not sure… Edwin Fischer and Richter (with Britten) come to mind (seems to be the only Mozart recording of richter I like…)… in 503 maybe Argerich with Goldberg or Edwin Fischer?

491… Pletnev comes to mind, Schnabel as well (though quite fast; but it sort of works in this piece)… should relisten to E. Fischer — richter is no good here, gieseking is no good here as well (Gieseking is good in 467, but doesn’t come close to anda)

466 Pletnev, Schnabel or E. Fischer probably…

536 certainly Pletnev

Post by DeepBlue
Thx

[JudeoN4zi]

Post by JudeoN4zi
466 Pletnev, Schnabel or E. Fischer probably…

Schnabel is really bad in 466... so it's either Pletnev and/or E. Fischer

[JudeoN4zi]

Argerich is bad in 503; as she is generally in Mozart…

[DeepBlue]

JudeoN4zi wrote:
? in 482… hmm not sure… Edwin Fischer

Post by JudeoN4zi
and Richter (with Britten) come to
mind (seems to be the only Mozart
recording of richter I like…)…

This is the finest 482 I heard live:

Ayako Uehara and Fabio Luisi
condycting the Wiener Symphoniker:

Leaves all others in the dust. Note
that she studied in Moscow with Vera
Gornostayeva, so she is a Russian
School pianist to all intents and
purposes. Her technique and sound
production are out of this world.

Cheers

[JudeoN4zi]

Post by DeepBlue
? in 482… hmm not sure… Edwin Fischer

Post by JudeoN4zi
and Richter (with Britten) come to
mind (seems to be the only Mozart
recording of richter I like…)…

Ayako Uehara and Fabio Luisi
http://youtu.be/6h9vhIu3aUM

Tomorrow

Post by DeepBlue
Leaves all others in the dust. Note
that she studied in Moscow with Vera
Gornostayeva, so she is a Russian
School pianist to all intents and
purposes. Her technique and sound
production are out of this world.
Cheers

[JudeoN4zi]

I think btw that Pletnev's Mozart PC recordings with the Deutsche Kammerphilharmonie Bremen are quite disappointing... very straightforward generally it seems, very boring... The newer KV 466 on yt is very bad (from 2023) as well; same as the one uploaded by ADGO (with some Russian (Moscow?) Orchestra)... I liked this 2-3 years ago... my taste has changed quite a bit... I also have to say, I very much liked E. Fischer at the beginning... but dunno got hung up on others, and was also looking for a better sound (and orchestra) I guess... but the sound is quite fine

So I think the best KV 466 I heard is E. Fischer with the LPO...

[JudeoN4zi]

You’ve actually already recommended me A Uehara in this work; it was - iirc - in the first thread I wrote in in this ng… about Bach‘s BWV 1052..

She’s very good here; it seems like you’re right, it’s probably the best I heard… makes me very critical of richter again… he’s really not good with Mozart…

[JudeoN4zi]

Post by JudeoN4zi
You’ve actually already recommended me A Uehara in this work; it was - iirc - in the first thread I wrote in in this ng… about Bach‘s BWV 1052..
She’s very good here; it seems like you’re right, it’s probably the best I heard… makes me very critical of richter again… he’s really not good with Mozart…

E. Fischer is still way better imo… but she is good…

[JudeoN4zi]

Post by JudeoN4zi

Post by JudeoN4zi
You’ve actually already recommended me A Uehara in this work; it was - iirc - in the first thread I wrote in in this ng… about Bach‘s BWV 1052..
She’s very good here; it seems like you’re right, it’s probably the best I heard… makes me very critical of richter again… he’s really not good with Mozart…

E. Fischer is still way better imo… but she is good…

Maybe not… maybe she is better than Fischer… after listening some more to Fischer I’m done with him, just like with Schnabel in Mozart (except for the a-minor rondo and maybe some sonatas?)… there are things I like about him, but generally too hurried…

I will compare richter vs uehara tomorrow in 482; maybe it’s richter here after all…

[JudeoN4zi]

Couldn’t wait until tomorrow; richter 482 is not good… uehara and Fischer I like more…

[JudeoN4zi]

Edwin Fischer sucks in 491.

[JudeoN4zi]

Listened to him in the second movement in 482, very nice, but I still
have some problems with it; same with the third movement… I don’t like
the first at all.

So I guess it’s richter/britten after all in 482…

After thinking about it… I might even ditch Mitropoulos‘ DG… I don’t
like this type of style too much in Mozart… it needs more control…

[JudeoN4zi]

Actually no... Mitropoulos' DG is just too good... orchestra is good,
singers are good... okay...

[Zionazi]

Fav Mozart PC recordings update (screw Gilels and Richter in Mozart):

KV 271: Pletnev
KV 365: Brendel/Klien
KV 450: YES (and maybe Ranki)
KV 466: Pletnev
KV 467: Anda, YES
KV 482: E. Fischer, Yunchan Lim (Ayako Uehara is also good)
KV 488: Horowitz (and maybe Pletnev)
KV 491: Gould/Susskind (and maybe Gould/Bernstein and Gould/Jochum and
maybe Pletnev)
KV 503: Argerich/Goldberg
KV 537: Pletnev

Have to revisit Horszowski and Bashkirov...

[Zionazi]

And Argerich/Jochum in KV 456.

[Zionazi]

Post by Zionazi
KV 271: Pletnev
KV 365: Brendel/Klien
KV 450: YES (and maybe Ranki)
KV 466: Pletnev
KV 467: Anda, YES
KV 482: E. Fischer, Yunchan Lim (Ayako Uehara is also good)

Yunchan Lim sucks (only listened to bits of the third and second
movement last time. Note: only if I say that these are the objectively
best recordings (at least concerning the more "important" and famous
releases of works up until that date) I'm done - as I did wrt the Mozart
Opera recordings) -- he really sucks...

E. Fischer is okay.

Ayako Uehara owns them all.

Post by Zionazi
KV 488: Horowitz (and maybe Pletnev)
KV 491: Gould/Susskind (and maybe Gould/Bernstein and Gould/Jochum and
maybe Pletnev)
KV 503: Argerich/Goldberg
KV 537: Pletnev
Have to revisit Horszowski and Bashkirov...

No Horszowski for me, but Bashkirov yes.

Add:

Bashkirov in KV 453 and KV 382
and
Ranki in KV 449 and 415.

[DeepBlue]

Post by Zionazi

Post by Zionazi
KV 271: Pletnev
KV 365: Brendel/Klien
KV 450: YES (and maybe Ranki)
KV 466: Pletnev
KV 467: Anda, YES
KV 482: E. Fischer, Yunchan Lim (Ayako Uehara is also good)

Yunchan Lim sucks (only listened to bits of the third and second
movement last time. Note: only if I say that these are the objectively
best recordings (at least concerning the more "important" and famous
releases of works up until that date) I'm done - as I did wrt the Mozart
Opera recordings) -- he really sucks...
E. Fischer is okay.
Ayako Uehara owns them all.

?!? AFAIK she has only been recorded in KV 482.
Are there any performances of other Meowszart
concertos by her ?!?

YC Lim sucks all the way to the bank ;-)

[Zionazi]

Update:

Ranki is not for me.

KV 246: Pletnev
KV 271: Pletnev
KV 365: Brendel/Klien
KV 382: Bashkirov
KV 415: Anda
KV 449: Bashkirov
KV 450: YES
KV 453: Bashkirov
KV 456: Argerich/Jochum
KV 466: Pletnev
KV 467: Anda, YES
KV 482: Ayako Uehara
KV 488: Horowitz (and maybe Pletnev)
KV 491: Gould/Susskind (and likely the other Goulds and Pletnev, should
probably also check out Lang Lang)
KV 503: Argerich/Goldberg
KV 537: Pletnev

[DeepBlue]

Post by Zionazi
Ranki is not for me.

Then why do you keep ranking composers
and performers ?!?

Post by Zionazi
KV 246: Pletnev
KV 271: Pletnev
KV 365: Brendel/Klien
KV 382: Bashkirov
KV 415: Anda
KV 449: Bashkirov
KV 450: YES
KV 453: Bashkirov
KV 456: Argerich/Jochum
KV 466: Pletnev
KV 467: Anda, YES
KV 482: Ayako Uehara
KV 488: Horowitz (and maybe Pletnev)
KV 491: Gould/Susskind (and likely the other

Goulds and Pletnev, should probably
also check out Lang Lang)

Post by Zionazi
KV 503: Argerich/Goldberg
KV 537: Pletnev

You cannot count to 595 ?!? ;-)

Lang Van Bang's LIVE 491 is superb.
The studio recording with the same
band and konduktor is less so.

[DeepBlue]

Post by DeepBlue

Post by Zionazi
Ranki is not for me.

Then why do you keep ranking composers
and performers ?!?

Post by Zionazi
KV 246: Pletnev
KV 271: Pletnev
KV 365: Brendel/Klien
KV 382: Bashkirov
KV 415: Anda
KV 449: Bashkirov
KV 450: YES
KV 453: Bashkirov
KV 456: Argerich/Jochum
KV 466: Pletnev
KV 467: Anda, YES
KV 482: Ayako Uehara
KV 488: Horowitz (and maybe Pletnev)
KV 491: Gould/Susskind (and likely the other

Goulds and Pletnev, should probably
also check out Lang Lang)

Post by Zionazi
KV 503: Argerich/Goldberg
KV 537: Pletnev

You cannot count to 595 ?!? ;-)
Lang Van Bang's LIVE 491 is superb.
The studio recording with the same
band and konduktor is less so.

The 2018 live performance with Honeck
has disappeared from YouTube, however
a more recent live Lang van Bang K491
performance has surfaced in YouTube:

My first impression is that the 2018
performance was "better". It's been a
while however since I last heard it
and I would have to listen again for
a fair comparison.

Cheers!

[DeepBlue]

Post by DeepBlue

Post by DeepBlue

Post by Zionazi
KV 491: Gould/Susskind (and likely the other

Goulds and Pletnev, should probably
also check out Lang Lang)
Lang Van Bang's LIVE 491 is superb.
The studio recording with the same
band and konduktor is less so.

The 2018 live performance with Honeck
has disappeared from YouTube, however
a more recent live Lang van Bang K491
http://youtu.be/PLbyLHwppag
My first impression is that the 2018
performance was "better". It's been a
while however since I last heard it
and I would have to listen again for
a fair comparison.

Listening right now, and the 2018 live
with Honeck sounds "better" indeed. I
squirreled away a copy -- email me if
you are interested.

Cheers!

[DeepBlue]

Post by DeepBlue

Post by DeepBlue

Post by DeepBlue

Post by Zionazi
KV 491: Gould/Susskind (and likely the other

Goulds and Pletnev, should probably
also check out Lang Lang)
Lang Van Bang's LIVE 491 is superb.
The studio recording with the same
band and konduktor is less so.

The 2018 live performance with Honeck
has disappeared from YouTube, however
a more recent live Lang van Bang K491
http://youtu.be/PLbyLHwppag
My first impression is that the 2018
performance was "better". It's been a
while however since I last heard it
and I would have to listen again for
a fair comparison.

Listening right now, and the 2018 live
with Honeck sounds "better" indeed. I
squirreled away a copy -- email me if
you are interested.

Having spent a few hours revisiting a
few well known KV 491 recordings, I
would say the top 3 to my ears are
Pletnev, Bashkirov and Lang van Bang.

One should listen to Schnabel, Fischer
Gieseking and Lili Kraus for historical
context and perspective.

Casadesus, Gould, Kempff, Schiff and
Uchida are obejct lessons in how not
to play the piano, let alone Mozart!
They are all sewing machines driven
by metronomes.

One surprising observation is how
many recordings sound out of tune!
This is perhaps understandable for
older performances digitized from
LPs.

Ciao!

[Zionazi]

Post by DeepBlue

Post by DeepBlue

Post by DeepBlue

Post by DeepBlue

Post by Zionazi
KV 491: Gould/Susskind (and likely the other

Goulds and Pletnev, should probably
also check out Lang Lang)
Lang Van Bang's LIVE 491 is superb.
The studio recording with the same
band and konduktor is less so.

The 2018 live performance with Honeck
has disappeared from YouTube, however
a more recent live Lang van Bang K491
http://youtu.be/PLbyLHwppag
My first impression is that the 2018
performance was "better". It's been a
while however since I last heard it
and I would have to listen again for
a fair comparison.

Listening right now, and the 2018 live
with Honeck sounds "better" indeed. I
squirreled away a copy -- email me if
you are interested.

Having spent a few hours revisiting a
few well known KV 491 recordings, I
would say the top 3 to my ears are
Pletnev, Bashkirov and Lang van Bang.

I don’t like Bashkirov here — neither of his two recordings. But the one
with Kogan seemed to be better. Too aggressive, hate the cadenza
(Schnabels is way more fun for example) — no magic happening, too much
rock n roll or sth.

Post by DeepBlue
One should listen to Schnabel, Fischer
Gieseking and Lili Kraus for historical
context and perspective.

Afair gieseking is no good here, Lili kraus neither… Schnabel and
Fischer are good, but not match for pletnev or Gould.

Post by DeepBlue
Casadesus, Gould, Kempff, Schiff and
Uchida are obejct lessons in how not
to play the piano, let alone Mozart!
They are all sewing machines driven
by metronomes.
One surprising observation is how
many recordings sound out of tune!
This is perhaps understandable for
older performances digitized from
LPs.
Ciao!

[Rachmaninoff]

In K. 466, the best version is by Paul Wee. Don't need no bloody
orchestra.

[Zionazi]

Post by Rachmaninoff
In K. 466, the best version is by Paul Wee. Don't need no bloody
orchestra.

Thanks for the rec

[Zionazi]

Post by Rachmaninoff
In K. 466, the best version is by Paul Wee. Don't need no bloody
orchestra.

From what I heard I quite like the transcription - not a fan of the
cadenza in the 1st movement though; problem for me is: the fucking
pianist...

[Zionazi]

Post by DeepBlue

Post by DeepBlue

Post by DeepBlue

Post by Zionazi
KV 491: Gould/Susskind (and likely the other

Goulds and Pletnev, should probably
also check out Lang Lang)
Lang Van Bang's LIVE 491 is superb.
The studio recording with the same
band and konduktor is less so.

The 2018 live performance with Honeck
has disappeared from YouTube, however
a more recent live Lang van Bang K491
http://youtu.be/PLbyLHwppag
My first impression is that the 2018
performance was "better". It's been a
while however since I last heard it
and I would have to listen again for
a fair comparison.

Listening right now, and the 2018 live
with Honeck sounds "better" indeed. I
squirreled away a copy -- email me if
you are interested.

We had already talked about this performance three years ago btw

https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.classical.recordings/c/3HLEhYV4IMY/m/NEhuSRJnAQAJ

It can also still be found here:

https://www.stage-plus.com/de/video/vod_concert_APNM8GRFDPHMASJKBSPJ6CG

Just a bit too lazy to register so if you want to send it to me via
email, feel free to do so. TIA

Post by DeepBlue
Cheers!

[Zionazi]

Post by Zionazi
KV 365: Brendel/Klien

*Actually seems to be Gilels/Gilels... fuck Brendel and Klien.