WAYLTL - November 2023

[Gerard]

Is it a trend? Discs with recordings of different composers living or working in Venice around 1720 - in Vivaldi's time.

"Grand Tour a Venezia" - works by Heinichen,Lotti, Pisendel, Veracini, Vivaldi, Zelenka
- Zefiro (Arcana)

"Concerto Veneziano" - works by Locatelli, Tartini, Vivaldi
- Carmignola, Marcon, Venice Baroque Orchestra (Archiv)

"Duello d'archi a Venezia" - works by Locatelli, Tartini, Veracini, Vivaldi
- Siranossian, Marcon, Venice Baroque Orchestra (alpha)

"Lost in Venice" - works by Marcello, Veracini, Vivaldi
- Makarenko, Infermi d'amore (Eudora Records)

"Venice: The Golden Age" - works by Marcello, Porta, Rom, Tessarini, Vivaldi
- Akademie für Alte Musik, Xenia Löffler, Georg Kallweit (harmonia mundi)

Also a few recordings by Chandler with La Serenissima.
The "programs" on those discs are much more various and attractive than discs with 7 or 8 violin concertos by Vivaldi.

[Herman]

String Quartet nr 12 by Darius Milhaud.
Published in 1945, dedicated to Gabriel Fauré memory.
Quatuor Parisii

[Frank Berger]

Post by Herman
String Quartet nr 12 by Darius Milhaud.
Published in 1945, dedicated to Gabriel Fauré memory.
Quatuor Parisii

This is equivalent to a blind link. No comment, no question, no discussion.

[Herman]

This is equivalent to a blind link. No comment, no question, no discussion.

In the WAYLTL topic people just post what they're listening to. No discussion.

[Todd M. McComb]

Post by Herman
In the WAYLTL topic people just post what they're listening to.

Yes. And the blind links don't say what they are! They're utterly
useless unless one visits a web site (without being given a reason
why).

[Andy Evans]

Post by Herman
In the WAYLTL topic people just post what they're listening to.

Yes. And the blind links don't say what they are! They're utterly
useless unless one visits a web site (without being given a reason
why).

Please tell that to DK......

[Herman]

Post by Andy Evans
Please tell that to DK......

Let's not. he's a troll.

[Dan Koren]

Post by Herman

This is equivalent to a blind link. No comment, no question, no discussion.

In the WAYLTL topic people just post what they're listening to. No discussion.

So what? Others can start discussions if they have something to say.

You seem to be making up rules on the fly for this ng.

Cheers

[Herman]

Post by Herman

This is equivalent to a blind link. No comment, no question, no discussion.

In the WAYLTL topic people just post what they're listening to. No discussion.

There are no rules and there is no moderator. The title of this topic, every month, is What Are You Listening To. It's not rocket science. The idea is to just mention what you're listening to and keep it simple.
The idea is not: slagging off what said posters are listening to, tell them they should be listening to something else. Nor is the idea to cast doubt on whether they were really listening to said record, which is about the silliest infantile thing I ever saw.
The idea is not necessarily that people should listen (or pretend to listen) to what I was listening to. I get no kick out of that.
However, if I mention that I listened to Milhaud's string quartet nr 12, and you want to hear that, too, the easiest thing to do is just to go to youtube and type milhaud 12 quartet and you're there. You could have done this in the time you're taking up bandwidth with complaining about lack of link, suggesting I did not listen to Milhaud at all, or that I suffer from tinnitus which I don't.

[Dan Koren]

Post by Herman

This is equivalent to a blind link. No comment, no question, no discussion.

In the WAYLTL topic people just post what they're listening to. No discussion.

I herefore submit a referral to Andy's insufficient discussion court.
Andy, please put Herman between bars.

dk

[Marc S]

Screw Fricsay...

I prefer Suitner's Figaro... and don't like much of Fricsay after all...

[Marc S]

Actually Screw Suitner's Figaro... it's one of the best... but it is no match for Fricsay's...

the best Figaros after Fricsay's are Suitner's and Kleiber's....

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S
Actually Screw Suitner's Figaro... it's one of the best... but it is no match for Fricsay's...
the best Figaros after Fricsay's are Suitner's and Kleiber's....

Kleiber's actually sucks thinking about it again - the only good thing are the singers (except Poell and maybe Danco). I probably even prefer Levine's over Kleiber's.

Still have to decide between Fricsay and Suitner though... tending towards Fricsay...

[Marc S]

Okay... I'm sure now... Suitner's Nozze is my favourite. Stader and Töpper I can't get over... they suck. And I also prefer Suitner's accompaniment.

[Marc S]

Screw Jochum's Cosi... Can't deal with Merriman... now I have to recheck Haitink and Levine... Karajan's is out as well...

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S
Screw Jochum's Cosi... Can't deal with Merriman... now I have to recheck Haitink and Levine... Karajan's is out as well...

and Suitner... and maybe evn Böhm's first...

[Marc S]

Actually Levine's Figaro is my second favourite after Suitner's... Fricsay's is just pretty bad in many aspects in hindishgt - he gets the phrasing right often, but the singing... and also the orchestra... the brass sounds very ugly sometimes etc...

[Marc S]

Well Levine's cosi sucks... Anne Murray... is just horrible... I might stick with Merriman here...

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S
Actually Levine's Figaro is my second favourite after Suitner's... Fricsay's is just pretty bad in many aspects in hindishgt - he gets the phrasing right often, but the singing... and also the orchestra... the brass sounds very ugly sometimes etc...

and forget what I said here... Levine's nozze sucks (just as his cosi) - even though the orchestra is really nice... Fricsay's is superior in every way... even if I hate some brass sounds... I guess Fricsay's and Kleiber's despite their failures would still be my choices after Suitner's.

[Dan Koren]

Post by Herman
String Quartet nr 12 by Darius Milhaud.
Published in 1945, dedicated to Gabriel
Fauré memory. Quatuor Parisii

This is equivalent to a blind link. No
comment, no question, no discussion.

No, it isn't. It is far less then a "blind link".
It doesn't point to any information at all,
however irrelevant. It only reminds us of
Herman's chronical tinnitus.

Cheers

[Dan Koren]

Post by Herman
String Quartet nr 12 by Darius Milhaud.
Published in 1945, dedicated to Gabriel
Fauré memory. Quatuor Parisii

Record or CD catalog number please?

Or a link to a streaming service that
others can use to listen? Otherwise
no one can tell if you actually heard
it, or if you just filled your ears with
cow shit.

dk

[Herman]

Max Reger, 2nd Piano Quartet, op 133, A minor.
A great work by I composer I'm much attached to.

Mannheim Quartet + Claudius Tanski
and
Trio Lirico + Detlev Eisinger.

both are excellent

[Herman]

Post by Herman
Max Reger, 2nd Piano Quartet, op 133, A minor.
A great work by I composer I'm much attached to.
Mannheim Quartet + Claudius Tanski
and
Trio Lirico + Detlev Eisinger.
both are excellent

The Mannheim is on MDG and is slightly more dramaric in the third, slow mvt,
The Lirico is on Audite
There is also the Aperto Piano Quartet on Naxos, here with the splendid scherzo with the amazing drone trio:

[Chris J.]

Post by Gerard
Is it a trend? Discs with recordings of different composers living or
working in Venice around 1720 - in Vivaldi's time.

A trend? I don't know.

BTW, Hasse (1699-1783) spent the winter of 1732/33 there, when Vivaldi
(1678–1741) was still around, owned a house in Venice since 1735 and lived
in that city during the final 10 years of his life.

Anyway, I have explored an 8CD box with J.S. Bach's solo concertos (5CDs)
and violin sonatas (3CDs) by Musica Alta Ripa, a smallish German period
instruments ensemble.

<https://www.jpc.de/jpcng/classic/detail/-/art/johann-sebastian-bach-solo-
konzerte-sonaten/hnum/8751069?lang=en>

I was going to recommend it, but the box is now OOP unfortunately. The
recordings were originally on MDG.

Chris

[Gerard]

Post by Chris J.

Post by Gerard
Is it a trend? Discs with recordings of different composers living or
working in Venice around 1720 - in Vivaldi's time.

A trend? I don't know.
BTW, Hasse (1699-1783) spent the winter of 1732/33 there, when Vivaldi
(1678–1741) was still around, owned a house in Venice since 1735 and lived
in that city during the final 10 years of his life.
Anyway, I have explored an 8CD box with J.S. Bach's solo concertos (5CDs)
and violin sonatas (3CDs) by Musica Alta Ripa, a smallish German period
instruments ensemble.
<https://www.jpc.de/jpcng/classic/detail/-/art/johann-sebastian-bach-solo-
konzerte-sonaten/hnum/8751069?lang=en>
I was going to recommend it, but the box is now OOP unfortunately. The
recordings were originally on MDG.
Chris

I don't know any work by Hasse, or any fine recording of his works. Do you have recommendations?

I have that Musica Alta Ripa box ( actually a slipcase with 5 cds) with the solo concertos.
These recordings are no favorite of mine, but sometimes I like listening to them.
But I'm not going to recommend it ;-)
A first recommendation is Café Zimmermann - also OOP of course ("Temporarily out of stock." - meaning: it's on MP3s only).

[Paul Goodman]

I just started listening to Civilization Phase 3 by Frank Zappa. There is
some amazing stuff here and I can’t help but think that he was influenced
somewhat by Harry Partch and Edgard Varese although I haven’t seen anything
in writing to support that. Just a feeling.

—
Paul Goodman

[mINE109]

Post by Paul Goodman
I just started listening to Civilization Phase 3 by Frank Zappa. There is
some amazing stuff here and I can’t help but think that he was influenced
somewhat by Harry Partch and Edgard Varese although I haven’t seen anything
in writing to support that. Just a feeling.

There's this:

https://wiki.killuglyradio.com/wiki/Frank_Zappa_on_Edgar_Varèse

[Paul Goodman]

Post by mINE109

Post by Paul Goodman
I just started listening to Civilization Phase 3 by Frank Zappa. There is
some amazing stuff here and I can’t help but think that he was influenced
somewhat by Harry Partch and Edgard Varese although I haven’t seen anything
in writing to support that. Just a feeling.

https://wiki.killuglyradio.com/wiki/Frank_Zappa_on_Edgar_Varèse

Thank you.

—
Paul Goodman

[Marc S]

Shcherbachov - Nonet (1919); no idea who the performers are unfortunately:

Part 1/2:

Part 2/2:

[sci.space]

Kind of a mixed bag for me, have eclectic taste.

Harmonia Mundi LP HMO 30,579 French pressing of a Compenius Frederiksborg organ recital played by Francis Chapelet. It sounds much better than the US Odyssey version. This was part of their historic organ series and was left out of the CD box set. It is a delightful organ with wonderful reed stops.

RCA LP LM1727 of Bartok's Sonata for Two Pianos and Percussion conducted by Stokowski. I have heard perhaps a dozen other recordings and this one seems best to me, phrased like music and not just sonic impact. It needs a mono cartridge to sound good. I am not aware of a CD release.

For something reasonably new a Norwegian CD (LAWO LWC1069) recorder recital played by Caroline Eidsten Dahl , all modern music. The centerpiece is Thommessen's Blockbird. Petri also recorded it, but this is much more satisfying, made me find and buy the sheet music to practice. I am not as good as Dahl.

[Al Eisner]

A Dacapo CD of the New York Philharmonic under Alan Gilbert in Nielsen's
Violin, Flute and Clarinet Concertos, with Nikolaj Znaider, Robert
Langevin, and Anthony McGill, all first-rate soloists. The recorded
sound is excellent, and NYP's percussion particularly stands out.
Three fine works; my favorite at the moment is the Clarinet Concerto,
which seems the most coherent of them. I'll leave any performance
comparisons to others.

[Marc S]

Guys, I just wanted to let you know that I actually like Beethoven more than Brahms... much, much more. I should check out his piano sonatas and chamber music some time again... so after Mozart he is my second favourite composer; and after that I don't know... I don't think I'll listen to much Bach or Brahms or Schubert or Schumann or Tchaikovsky or Prokofiev or Rachmaninov or Chopin or whatever in the future...

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S
Guys, I just wanted to let you know that I actually like Beethoven more than Brahms... much, much more. I should check out his piano sonatas and chamber music some time again... so after Mozart he is my second favourite composer; and after that I don't know... I don't think I'll listen to much Bach or Brahms or Schubert or Schumann or Tchaikovsky or Prokofiev or Rachmaninov or Chopin or whatever in the future...

and I probably prefer Schubert over Bach and Bach over Brahms; Brahms is just too heavy, but he is has some very beautiful moments... So, probably Schubert after Beethoven and Bach after Schubert.

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S

Post by Marc S
Guys, I just wanted to let you know that I actually like Beethoven more than Brahms... much, much more. I should check out his piano sonatas and chamber music some time again... so after Mozart he is my second favourite composer; and after that I don't know... I don't think I'll listen to much Bach or Brahms or Schubert or Schumann or Tchaikovsky or Prokofiev or Rachmaninov or Chopin or whatever in the future...

*Take Bach and Schubert out of this list...

Post by Marc S
and I probably prefer Schubert over Bach and Bach over Brahms; Brahms is just too heavy, but he is has some very beautiful moments... So, probably Schubert after Beethoven and Bach after Schubert.

[Oscar]

Looking forward to attending The English Concert on tour at LA Opera in a couple weeks. Handel's Rodelinda from 1725. Harry Bicket conducts. Any particular favorite recordings of this work by members-in-good-standing of the r.m.c.r.?

[Notsure01]

Post by Oscar
Looking forward to attending The English Concert on tour at LA Opera in a couple weeks. Handel's Rodelinda from 1725. Harry Bicket conducts. Any particular favorite recordings of this work by members-in-good-standing of the r.m.c.r.?

I may not be in-good-standing (I'm Notsure) but my favorite version is
an LP on Westminster with Stich-Randall and Forrester:
Martin Isepp (harpsichord), Teresa Stich-Randall (soprano), Maureen
Forrester (contralto), Hilde Rössel-Majdan (contralto), Alexander Young
(tenor), John Boyden (bass), Helen Watts (contralto)
Vienna Radio Orchestra
Brian Priestman
Recorded: 1964-06-06
Recording Venue: Mozart Saal, Konzerthaus, Vienna (Wien)

I AM sure it is not Historically Informed, but it is beautifully sung
and dramatic.

It is available on Presto along with 22 hours of dozens of unusual
works: Westminster Legacy - The Collector's Edition Vol. 2
https://www.prestomusic.com/classical/products/8036728--westminster-legacy-the-collectors-edition-vol-2

[Oscar]

Post by Marc S
Guys, I just wanted to let you know that I actually like Beethoven more than Brahms... much, much more. I should check
out his piano sonatas and chamber music some time again... so after Mozart he is my second favourite composer; and
after that I don't know... I don't think I'll listen to much Bach or Brahms or Schubert or Schumann or Tchaikovsky or Prokofiev
or Rachmaninov or Chopin or whatever in the future...

Mmm k. Keep us posted.

[Marc S]

Post by Oscar

Post by Marc S
Guys, I just wanted to let you know that I actually like Beethoven more than Brahms... much, much more. I should check
out his piano sonatas and chamber music some time again... so after Mozart he is my second favourite composer; and
after that I don't know... I don't think I'll listen to much Bach or Brahms or Schubert or Schumann or Tchaikovsky or Prokofiev
or Rachmaninov or Chopin or whatever in the future...

Mmm k. Keep us posted.

And you keep fanboying over an antisemite like deacon...

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S

Post by Oscar

Post by Marc S
Guys, I just wanted to let you know that I actually like Beethoven more than Brahms... much, much more. I should check
out his piano sonatas and chamber music some time again... so after Mozart he is my second favourite composer; and
after that I don't know... I don't think I'll listen to much Bach or Brahms or Schubert or Schumann or Tchaikovsky or Prokofiev
or Rachmaninov or Chopin or whatever in the future...

Mmm k. Keep us posted.

And you keep fanboying over an antisemite like deacon...

*rather fawning over

[Marc S]

It's kind of funny that I actually have a record from deacon... I bought his Krips Beethoven Cycle over a discogs account managed by a friend of his after his passing:

https://www.discogs.com/user/TomDeaconCollection

[Marc S]

Post by Oscar

Post by Marc S
Guys, I just wanted to let you know that I actually like Beethoven more than Brahms... much, much more. I should check
out his piano sonatas and chamber music some time again... so after Mozart he is my second favourite composer; and
after that I don't know... I don't think I'll listen to much Bach or Brahms or Schubert or Schumann or Tchaikovsky or Prokofiev
or Rachmaninov or Chopin or whatever in the future...

Mmm k. Keep us posted.

Forget what I wrote about Brahms... I actually do think he is my second favourite composer after Mozart; he is also not heavy - depending on how he is played - though he is "heavier" than Mozart ofc.

I just can't really get into Beethoven...

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S

Post by Oscar

Post by Marc S
Guys, I just wanted to let you know that I actually like Beethoven more than Brahms... much, much more. I should check
out his piano sonatas and chamber music some time again... so after Mozart he is my second favourite composer; and
after that I don't know... I don't think I'll listen to much Bach or Brahms or Schubert or Schumann or Tchaikovsky or Prokofiev
or Rachmaninov or Chopin or whatever in the future...

Mmm k. Keep us posted.

Forget what I wrote about Brahms... I actually do think he is my second favourite composer after Mozart; he is also not heavy - depending on how he is played - though he is "heavier" than Mozart ofc.
I just can't really get into Beethoven...

Need some more time to decide...

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S

Post by Marc S

Post by Oscar

Post by Marc S
Guys, I just wanted to let you know that I actually like Beethoven more than Brahms... much, much more. I should check
out his piano sonatas and chamber music some time again... so after Mozart he is my second favourite composer; and
after that I don't know... I don't think I'll listen to much Bach or Brahms or Schubert or Schumann or Tchaikovsky or Prokofiev
or Rachmaninov or Chopin or whatever in the future...

Mmm k. Keep us posted.

Forget what I wrote about Brahms... I actually do think he is my second favourite composer after Mozart; he is also not heavy - depending on how he is played - though he is "heavier" than Mozart ofc.
I just can't really get into Beethoven...

Need some more time to decide...

As mentioned in the other thread my second favourite composer after Mozart is Beethoven (Symphonies, Missa Solemnis, PCs -- going to dig through his chamber music and solo piano again soon).

and they are by far my two favourite composers... I was an idiot doubting Beethoven...

[JohnGavin]

Steven Osborne’s brand new release of Debussy’s Etudes, Pour le Piano, and miscellany. It sounds fine - but I suspect Anthony Di Bonaventura’s Etudes are still my favorites.

The Osborne recording ends his Debussy series on Hyperion which includes all the major piano works - all beautifully performed.

[Chris J.]

Post by Gerard
I don't know any work by Hasse, or any fine recording of his works. Do
you have recommendations?

Hasse left a large body of work and was probably best known as a composer
of (numerous) operas. I only know some of his church music and to my
knowledge none of the recordings I've heard is still available on CD. You
can hear some of his music on KorenTube, sorry, I mean YouTube.

For instance:

Mass in D minor:

Requiem in C major:

Regina Coeli, Motet in D major:

Chris

[Gerard]

Post by Chris J.

Post by Gerard
I don't know any work by Hasse, or any fine recording of his works. Do
you have recommendations?

Hasse left a large body of work and was probably best known as a composer
of (numerous) operas. I only know some of his church music and to my
knowledge none of the recordings I've heard is still available on CD. You
can hear some of his music on KorenTube, sorry, I mean YouTube.
http://youtu.be/qnryXpAmlVE
http://youtu.be/7t4GVeaJOm0
http://youtu.be/xMdrE1XvC2A
Chris

Thanks!
I was hoping for some unknown (by me) music for orchestra of chamber ensembles ;-)
Alas, church music (or opera) is not my thing.

[Marc S]

Sergey Prokofiev (1891-1953): Cello Sonata in C-Major, op. 119 (1949)
Sol Gabetta, Cello / Polina Leschenko, Piano

[Marc S]

Moriz Rosenthal plays Liadov "Tabatière a Musique" op. 32

[Dan Koren]

Post by Gerard
I was hoping for some unknown (by me)
music for orchestra of chamber ensembles ;-)
Alas, church music (or opera) is not my thing.

Good to hear you still have a slight trace of
reason left between your ears! ;-)

Cheers

[mINE109]

Vivica Genaux, A Tribute to Faustina Bordoni, with arias by Hasse and
Handel composed for the famed singer who became Hasse's wife.

[Owen Hartnett]

Yuja vs. Temirkanov vs. Shostakovich via Slipped Disc:
https://slippedisc.com/2023/11/temirkanov-was-misogynist-watch-him-with-yuja/?fbclid=IwAR0rlEYEv21bdrHq2w5VgCe6qg2qvXV8f4T978geoh9IYZgWbQ65spgP4nE

-Owen

[Todd M. McComb]

"In 1945, Mary Lou Williams (1910-1981) completed the composition
of the Zodiac Suite. Each movement corresponded to an artist's
portrait associated with an astrological sign. It was a pretext to
escape the rigidity of the musical forms for which Williams had
previously written, and to experiment with the sonorities of the
music of European composers such as Berg, Hindemith or Schoenberg.

Although the Suite was composed for piano, Williams undertook to
orchestrate it for chamber orchestra. Late in 1945, the public
premiere left the composer frustrated,. A close look at Williams'
manuscripts clearly shows that the music that was performed that
night does not reflect the composer's original intentions. Movements
had been stripped of their orchestration and performed as solo
piano, entire sections had been cut, and multiple errors had not
been corrected, due to a lack of time and resources.

A cornerstone of Williams' artistic life, this legendary work has
never been recorded in its original form. After working for several
years on the Mary Lou Williams archives, publishing the album Mary's
Ideas (Umlaut Records 2021) and being selected as a Villa Albertine
2023 resident, Pierre-Antoine Badaroux decided to tackle the chamber
orchestra version of the Zodiac Suite, in an interpretation that
underlines its heterogeneity and its richness."

https://umlautrecords.bandcamp.com/album/zodiac-suite

[Herman]

Mahler, Rückertlieder. Magdalena Kozena, Rattle, BRSO

There is also an earlier 'Abhanden gekommen' with Kozena and Abbado in Luzern.

[Herman]

Post by Herman
Mahler, Rückertlieder. Magdalena Kozena, Rattle, BRSO
http://youtu.be/Tr5YFE1wgUc
There is also an earlier 'Abhanden gekommen' with Kozena and Abbado in Luzern.

The earlier Kozena performance is really special.

[Andrew Clarke]

On Wednesday, November 1, 2023 at 9:11:53 PM UTC+11, Gerard wrote:

You guessed it. Ravel. Daphnis et Chloe. Sinfonia of London. John Wilson.
Mr Wilson spent most of the Covid lockdown, when of course, he couldn't give concerts, preparing a new edition, resolving many difficulties with the existing published score, and incorporating changes made by Ravel to the orchestral parts. This apparently make everything a good deal easier for the orchestra, although, according to the reviewers, there are no major differences so far as the audience is concerned. Like just about everything else Mr Wilson has done, the main virtue is clarity, to which you can add the much-praised string sound of the Sinfonia of London.

[Paolo Pesenti]

Re-listening to Beethoven C major piano concerto (No.1 Op.15) with Michelangeli and Giulini in 1979. A one-off recording in the discography of ABM (there is only another version recorded a few days earlier with De Stouz in Zurich, never published) it provides the ideal missing link between the Haydn No.11 and Beethoven's Emperor, two multi-recorded concertos by the pianist. The links with Mozart, quite explicit in other interpretations (say, the "Turkish march" echoes in the third movement) are not emphasized in this interpretation. As often with ABM playing against an orchestra, the truly magic moment is the cadenza in the first movement, when the orchestra actually stops playing for several minutes and the the full spotlight is on the solo pianist. ABM chooses the third cadenza written by Beethoven about ten years after the concerto itself, and stylistically way more advanced than the rest of the concerto. This is quite standard since Schnabel, but not universal. For instance, Kempff chooses the second cadenza with a few modifications on his own; Richter plays the third cadenza but cuts the last third or so. ABM plays the whole enchilada and plays it wonderfully, making it sound as an improvised rhapsody, a roller-coaster of accelerandos and ritardandos from bar to bar with all the chromatic flourishes, the diminished fifth arpeggios and especially the triple trills that foreshadow the Beethoven yet-to-come by late XVIII century standards. The rest of the recording is good, with Giulini reliable and elegant as usual and the VPO nicely recorded live for a televised occasion. But the cadenza is special.

I listened to it on cd, but the You Tube link is

[Marc S]

Cziffra playing Liszt's Valse Impromptu:

Stumbled on it yesterday evening again; haven't listened to it in quite a while. Beautiful piece and Cziffra is amazing.

[Andy Evans]

Listened to Wagner's Meistersinger Act 1 yesterday evening. I didn't realise that it's almost all in 3/4 and 6/8. It doesn't sound at all "waltzy" so I never really bothered counting it out. I imagine a whole act in 3/4 and 6/8 is relatively unusual in operas, but I'm wiling to be corrected if anyone can cite other examples.

I think the whole opera is incredible - an endless outpouring of wonderful melody and clever counterpoint from the orchestra behind the vocals. The craftsmanship takes my breath away.

[Marc S]

Found two nozzes I like much more than Fricsay's - Abbado's and Levine's; haven't decided for a favourite yet.

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S
Found two nozzes I like much more than Fricsay's - Abbado's and Levine's; haven't decided for a favourite yet.

Hmmm naa... after listening further to Levine... he sucks... both Figaros I heard.

But I very much like Abbado's.

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S

Post by Marc S
Found two nozzes I like much more than Fricsay's - Abbado's and Levine's; haven't decided for a favourite yet.

Hmmm naa... after listening further to Levine... he sucks... both Figaros I heard.

Hmmmm... after listening again... the CD version with Kanawa is actually quite good... the other I did not like so much (don't like Fleming at all).

Post by Marc S
But I very much like Abbado's.

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S

Post by Marc S
Found two nozzes I like much more than Fricsay's - Abbado's and Levine's; haven't decided for a favourite yet.

Hmmm naa... after listening further to Levine... he sucks... both Figaros I heard.
But I very much like Abbado's.

Scratch that... Abbado's sucks... sorry guys... I was a bit too fast on this one. Lucio Gallo sucks so bad; rubbed me the wrong way directly (didn't listen to Figaro's parts when I commented above)... and often I'm aksi not so sure about Abbado's phrasing...

likely Fricsay's is still my favourite... will listen a bit more to Levine's... he does some things very nicely imo...

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S

Post by Marc S

Post by Marc S
Found two nozzes I like much more than Fricsay's - Abbado's and Levine's; haven't decided for a favourite yet.

Hmmm naa... after listening further to Levine... he sucks... both Figaros I heard.
But I very much like Abbado's.

Scratch that... Abbado's sucks... sorry guys... I was a bit too fast on this one. Lucio Gallo sucks so bad; rubbed me the wrong way directly (didn't listen to Figaro's parts when I commented above)... and often I'm aksi not so sure about Abbado's phrasing...
likely Fricsay's is still my favourite... will listen a bit more to Levine's... he does some things very nicely imo...

Hmmm Levine's is really beautiful... from what I heard... I think I might like it more than Fricsay's... need a bit more time.

[Marc S]

Finally found my favourite Figaro... it's Levine's... so good...

His DG is also really good from what I heard as far as now.

[Marc S]

Also I can't recommend Krips' Serail on Pearl I listed before anymore; the singing sucks too often... (It was obvious from the start, but in some way I found it charming; the production, I mean. And Krips' conducting is just really good)

[Marc S]

Sorry guys, forget everything I wrote about Figaro and DG and Levine. Levine sucks... Fricsay's Nozze is much, much better.

But Levine does some things beautifully. I also really dislike Furlanetto.

[Herman]

Has anyone ever given any indication of reading, let alone taking seriously these iinfantile brain farts of yours?
Classical music is clearly way over your head.

[Marc S]

Post by Herman
Has anyone ever given any indication of reading, let alone taking seriously these iinfantile brain farts of yours?
Classical music is clearly way over your head.

lol

[Marc S]

Okay... my bad... Furlanetto is fucking great... don't know what was wrong with me yesterday...

Levine is fucking great as well... screw Fricsay's Figaro; Levine's all the way (I seem to also really enjoy his DG - as already mentioned - as well as his cosi).

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S
Okay... my bad... Furlanetto is fucking great... don't know what was wrong with me yesterday...

Just needed a bit of sleep I guess...

Post by Marc S
Levine is fucking great as well... screw Fricsay's Figaro; Levine's all the way (I seem to also really enjoy his DG - as already mentioned - as well as his cosi).

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S

Post by Marc S
Okay... my bad... Furlanetto is fucking great... don't know what was wrong with me yesterday...

Just needed a bit of sleep I guess...

Post by Marc S
Levine is fucking great as well... screw Fricsay's Figaro; Levine's all the way (I seem to also really enjoy his DG - as already mentioned - as well as his cosi).

It was Thomas Hampson... I didn't have problems with Furlanetto yesterday, but with Hampson - he is good though; need to listen some more.

[Marc S]

WRT Krips's Beethoven Cycle: It's beautiful, but I don't need it. Will sort it out.

Mengelberg and Celibidache's rank at the very top for me; and after a huge gap there is Karajan and Szell...

[Marc S]

Screw Levine; he does some things beautifully... but he is no Fricsay... I also seem to like the singers more on Fricsay's Mozart Opera recordings.... really don't like Hampson. Dieskau I actually like I figured...

So my favourite nozze still is Fricsay's...

[Marc S]

Screw Szell... Krips' cycle is better imo, as is Karajan's.

Szell is just too mechanic... I always had this problem with Szell. What made me reconsider him in Beethoven was his Missa Solemnis I heard a few days ago... but hmmm... n,o Szell sucks. And I'm gonna keep the Krips cycle - it's great; and it's not just beautiful and lyrical, but also strict - which I like.

So my fav Beethoven Cycles are as follows:

At the very top: Mengelberg (still going through different recordings and releases of recordings of his; Tahra, Opus Kura, Hubert Wendel) and Celibidache (EMI).

Then: Krips and Karajan...

[Marc S]

As much as I dislike Szell... his Missa is really good... probably the best... this makes me want to reconsider his beethoven symphonies again...

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S
As much as I dislike Szell... his Missa is really good... probably the best... this makes me want to reconsider his beethoven symphonies again...

His Beethoven Symphonies suck imo... nowhere near as good as Karajan's or Krips's; as well as his accompaniment in the mozart concertos with casadeus - sucks. Still not a fan of Szell. But the Missa is good.

[Marc S]

I really don't understand how Honeck's unimaginative cycle gets any praise... it's totally shit.

[Oscar]

Post by Herman
Has anyone ever given any indication of reading, let alone taking seriously these iinfantile brain farts of yours?
Classical music is clearly way over your head.

I am trying to make sense of what's going on in this thread here. I just came by to post my latest WAYLTL. Sheesh. Which, by the by, is some La divina:

Verdi: I Vespri Siciliani

Chorus of the Maggio Musicale Fiorentino
Maggio Musicale Fiorentino / Erich Kleiber

Legendary Recordings LR-CD-1008 3CD ℗ © unknown.
Mono.
Recorded LIVE at the Teatro Comunale, Florence, on May 26, 1951.

NOTE: Unknown issue date. Discs manufactured in Austria by KOCH. No IFPI codes on disc matrix, therefore almost certainly pre-1994. First CD release? I found this fat-boy double-wide 3CD in the bins yesterday, New Old Stock sealed, with a "Doubleday $39.98" price sticker on verso!! Single page insert with track listings (and just 5 or 6 per disc, at that). This is certainly sourced from LPs, likely from one of the following vinyl boxed sets. In 2007, Testament issued this recording anew with mastering by Paul Baily. I do not know how much of an improvement it is over the transfer on offer here, which is distorted in choral tuttis. That could be a remnant of the original source, however. In 2017, Warner Classics reissued the Testament title, although I cannot be certain if there was any re-equalization as part of its release. P.S. Kleiber père kicks ass.

Penzance 6 3LP; Cetra LO 5/3 3LP; Mauro R Fuguette MRF 46 3LP; or, Melodram MEL 420 3LP.

Guido di Montforte - Enzo Mascherini
Il Sire di Bethume - Bruno Carmassi
Il Conte Vaudemont - Mario Frosini
Arrigo - Giorgio Kokolios Bardi
Giovanni da Procida - Boris Christoff
La Duchessa Elena - Maria Callas
Ninetta - Mafalda Masini
Danieli - Gino Sarri
Tebaldo - Aldo De Paolo
Roberto - Lido Pettini
Manfredo - Breno Ristori

[Oscar]

From Gramophone, January 2008:

<< The cleaned-up sound makes this famous Callas calling card a must

This recording, like Verdi’s opera, has attracted mixed reviews over the years. Composed for Paris in 1855, Les Vepres siciliennes has never enjoyed the affection of critics or public in the way the other “mid-period” operas (Boccanegra, Ballo and Forza) have.

This revival was one of the productions that helped to spread Maria Callas’s fame. At the time, Lord Harewood wrote memorably in Opera magazine about the tremendous force she puts into the recitative in Act 1, in which the Duchess Elena encourages the Sicilian population to rebellion with the words “Il vostro fato e in vostra man” (“Your fate is in your own hands”).

Callas is terrific in the Act 1 aria and cabaletta, as well as in the long duet with Arrigo in Act 4, sung by Greek tenor Giorgio Kokolios-Bardi. He had been one of Callas’s leading men at the National Opera in Athens, and she particularly requested him for this part. He’s no Di Stefano but he gives a good performance, especially of the aria in the fourth act, “Giorno di pianto”. In some ways this opera is dominated by the two low male voices – Boris Christoff is magnificent as the gloomy, unforgiving Procida, while Enzo Mascherini is in his element as the anguished Guido di Montforte, who finds out too late that his opponent is his own son.

Erich Kleiber is not usually associated with the 19th-century Italian repertory but he leads a vigorous performance, although there are quite a few cuts. This tape (made for Walter Legge) does not include the overture, so the opera fits on two CDs. For Callas and Christoff admirers, of course, this is an essential document. Although the sound quality is variable, it is clearer than previous issues. The Testament booklet is excellent, the libretto available to download from the company’s website. >>

[Andy Evans]

Post by Oscar
Callas is terrific in the Act 1 aria and cabaletta, as well as in the long duet with Arrigo in Act 4,

Great to see so much enthusiasm for music in your post! It reminds us why we are all here.

[Marc S]

Post by Andy Evans

Post by Oscar
Callas is terrific in the Act 1 aria and cabaletta, as well as in the long duet with Arrigo in Act 4,

Great to see so much enthusiasm for music in your post! It reminds us why we are all here.

Oscar is just sharing a Gramophone article from 2008; what does that have to do with "enthusiasm for music" lol... It would be nice to hear Oscar - for once - give his own opinions about recordings...

[Marc S]

My favourite Mozart opera recordings:

Serail: Jochum, Krips (EMI)
Nozze: Suitner
DG: Krips, Mitropoulos
Cosi: Böhm Nr 2 and Nr 3 (He recorded it 4x)
Zauberflöte: Fischer, Sawallisch

I will have to reevaluate Fischer's Zauberflöte vs Sawallisch's...

[Marc S]

*regarding the Mozart operas I know well enough.

Post by Marc S
Serail: Jochum, Krips (EMI)
Nozze: Suitner
DG: Krips, Mitropoulos
Cosi: Böhm Nr 2 and Nr 3 (He recorded it 4x)

*He recorded it 5x... anyway I like the 1955 and 1962 one.

Post by Marc S
Zauberflöte: Fischer, Sawallisch
I will have to reevaluate Fischer's Zauberflöte vs Sawallisch's...

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S
*regarding the Mozart operas I know well enough.

Post by Marc S
Serail: Jochum, Krips (EMI)
Nozze: Suitner
DG: Krips, Mitropoulos
Cosi: Böhm Nr 2 and Nr 3 (He recorded it 4x)

*He recorded it 5x... anyway I like the 1955 and 1962 one.

Post by Marc S
Zauberflöte: Fischer, Sawallisch

Prefer Fischer's over Sawallisch's by far... wrt Berry... I guess I generally like him, but he is no Papageno for me... awful Papagena as well and an awful Queen (I know she is regarded as a good one... or one of the best); and obviously Schreier... Fricsay's is much better than Sawallisch's also...

Post by Marc S

Post by Marc S
I will have to reevaluate Fischer's Zauberflöte vs Sawallisch's...

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S

Post by Marc S
*regarding the Mozart operas I know well enough.

Post by Marc S
Serail: Jochum, Krips (EMI)
Nozze: Suitner
DG: Krips, Mitropoulos
Cosi: Böhm Nr 2 and Nr 3 (He recorded it 4x)

*He recorded it 5x... anyway I like the 1955 and 1962 one.

Post by Marc S
Zauberflöte: Fischer, Sawallisch

Prefer Fischer's over Sawallisch's by far... wrt Berry... I guess I generally like him, but he is no Papageno for me... awful Papagena as well and an awful Queen (I know she is regarded as a good one... or one of the best); and obviously Schreier... Fricsay's is much better than Sawallisch's also...

Should say I also do not like Rothenberger as Pamina here...

Post by Marc S

Post by Marc S

Post by Marc S
I will have to reevaluate Fischer's Zauberflöte vs Sawallisch's...

[Marc S]

Actually add Fricsay's Figaro and his magic flute to my favourites... forget what I said about his brass... I guess there are moments that bug me... have to think about it more; or rather... it works I guess and I have to deal with it. Suitner also has some problems imo... anyway these are my two favourites figaros.

[Todd M. McComb]

Post by Oscar
I am trying to make sense of what's going on in this thread here.
I just came by to post my latest WAYLTL. Sheesh.

Some sort of filibuster, I guess.

[Oscar]

Post by Todd M. McComb
Some sort of filibuster, I guess.

McComb: I am going to see Harry Bicket and The English Concerteers tonight at Dorothy Chandler Pavilion. Doing a little thing called Rodelinda. One night only! Got great seats in Founders Circle, which is the best in a very middling-sounding venue. This is the second English Concert visit to LA Opera this year, having performed Solomon in March. Rodelinda was originally scheduled for May 2020, but the virus-from-a-place-that-shall-remain-woohanless derailed/dashed/scuttled that.

Excited!

RODELINDA - Lucy Crowe
BERTARIDO - Iestyn Davies
GRIMOALDO - Eric Ferring
UNULFO - Aryeh Nussbaum Cohen
EDUIGE - Christine Rice
GARIBALDO - Brandon Cedel

Harry Bicket conducts The English Concert

[Herman]

So I guess that was on your bicket list?

Post by Oscar
Harry Bicket conducts The English Concert

[Oscar]

Post by Herman
So I guess that was on your bicket list?

Indeed. I'm not going to let the terrorists win. #handelforall #freedomconcert #bringhomeoutgirlsandboys

[Marc S]

So fucking difficult deciding which Mozart opera recordings are my favourite...

Listened into so many cosis lately... Stiedry, Busch, Rosbaud, Muti, Levine, Jacobs, A. Fischer, Cambreling... haven't heard Moralt (but his DG is not bad).... and so many others...

the best ones are probably really Karajan and Böhm 1955 & 1962...

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S
So fucking difficult deciding which Mozart opera recordings are my favourite...
Listened into so many cosis lately... Stiedry, Busch, Rosbaud, Muti, Levine, Jacobs, A. Fischer, Cambreling... haven't heard Moralt (but his DG is not bad).... and so many others...

I didn't like his DG that much... but I was sort of surprised - as in it was better than expected.

Post by Marc S
the best ones are probably really Karajan and Böhm 1955 & 1962...

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S
So fucking difficult deciding which Mozart opera recordings are my favourite...
Listened into so many cosis lately... Stiedry, Busch, Rosbaud, Muti, Levine, Jacobs, A. Fischer, Cambreling... haven't heard Moralt (but his DG is not bad).... and so many others...
the best ones are probably really Karajan and Böhm 1955 & 1962...

Thinking about the singers; screw Karajan's cosi...

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S

Post by Marc S
So fucking difficult deciding which Mozart opera recordings are my favourite...
Listened into so many cosis lately... Stiedry, Busch, Rosbaud, Muti, Levine, Jacobs, A. Fischer, Cambreling... haven't heard Moralt (but his DG is not bad).... and so many others...
the best ones are probably really Karajan and Böhm 1955 & 1962...

Thinking about the singers; screw Karajan's cosi...

and the orchestra is too much going for a war; similar to Kleiber's Figaro... this does not work in these works... it must be subversive, subtle...

[Marc S]

Granted though Kleiber's Figaro is much better than any of Böhm's... but not as good as Suitner's or Fricsay's... such a pity, because the singers are great...

[Marc S]

Actually Screw Fricsay's Zauberflöte... the only recording of his that I heard and like is his Figaro...

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S
Actually Screw Fricsay's Zauberflöte... the only recording of his that I heard and like is his Figaro...

He's always so in your face...

[Marc S]

Oh man Berry is a wonderful Papageno in Böhm's early Zauberflöte; and Güden is great... I think I need this... it's beautiful from what I heard (apart of Simoneau).

[Marc S]

Fricsay's Figaro sucks... his accompaniment as well as much of the singing...

the best 3 figaros imo are: Kleiber from 1955 and Böhm and Suitner both from 1968... not sure which is my favourite...

Marriner and Levine are also fine... still have to decide on my favourite...

[Marc S]

Post by Marc S
Fricsay's Figaro sucks... his accompaniment as well as much of the singing...
the best 3 figaros imo are: Kleiber from 1955 and Böhm and Suitner both from 1968... not sure which is my favourite...

*Suitner is 64 and Böhm is 67...

Post by Marc S
Marriner and Levine are also fine... still have to decide on my favourite...