Discussion:
Brahms Piano Concerto 2 - favourites?
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Andy Evans
2019-07-20 08:37:47 UTC
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Plenty of recordings of this work, but which of them are you most satisfied with?
Andy Evans
2019-07-20 10:42:10 UTC
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Post by Andy Evans
Plenty of recordings of this work, but which of them are you most satisfied with?
Provisional list - need to listen to them some more, but I like what I hear in these

Richter/Leinsdorf
Kissin/BBC/A.Davis

Pollini/VPO/Abbado

Solomon/Philh/Dobrowen

Fleisher/Cleveland/Szell

Fischer/BPOFurtwangler 1942

Rubinstein/BSO/Munch 1952

Rubinstein/RAI/Cluytens

Horowitz/NBC/Toscanini 1940

Bozo
2019-07-20 12:02:43 UTC
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Gilels,Reiner,CSO,1958 RCA

Backhaus,Bohm,VPO,1967,Decca

https://tch16.medici.tv/en/piano/ Kantorow,Petrenko, live at 2019 Tchaikovsky Competition Finals
HT
2019-07-20 12:14:08 UTC
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Post by Bozo
http://youtu.be/D3k2a4Gi0Fc Backhaus,Bohm,VPO,1967,Decca
Seconded. It's my favorite version. My favorite version by far.

Henk
c***@gmail.com
2019-07-20 12:34:49 UTC
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Post by Bozo
http://youtu.be/NI4VQFJluZk Gilels,Reiner,CSO,1958 RCA
Agreed. Hard to choose out of 300+ recordings, eh? I also like

Serkin/Ormandy (my favorite overall)
Anda/Rosbaud
Moravec/Belohlavek
One of the Arraus (I prefer Arrau/Haitink to Arrau/Giulini)
With some technical issues: Scarpini/Gui; Hess/Walter

AC
Andy Evans
2019-07-20 13:24:43 UTC
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Gilels is often recommended, but not my taste, neither is Serkin or Arrau. Give me Richter. Hess has Walter conducting, but is a little fussy for me. Shame - a pianist i like. Moravec/Belohlavek certainly has very nice moments, not sure if I like it enough overall.

There are a few Backhaus, and maybe the Schuricht is more of a contender than the celebrated Bohm version, which I find rather meh in parts of the 1st movement.

No takers for Rubinstein? Lovely playing, and I especially like the earlier versions with Munch and Cluytens.

I think Kissin is not to be overlooked here - excellent pianism and idiomatic support from Andrew Davis. I think this was a Prom broadcast. I like it, and good sound. It's on YT - I posted the link.

Solomon, Fleisher, Fischer and Horowitz clearly have supporters - some excellent pianism.

I'm not much of a Pollini fan boy, but his early version with Abbado is full of character and interesting detail - far from what I expected.
Bozo
2019-07-20 14:59:51 UTC
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Post by Andy Evans
No takers for Rubinstein? Lovely playing, and I especially like the earlier versions with Munch and Cluytens.
AR's with Cluytens is one of my favs.
dk
2019-07-20 22:57:43 UTC
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Post by Andy Evans
Post by Andy Evans
Plenty of recordings of this work, but which of them are you most satisfied with?
Provisional list - need to listen to them some more, but I like what I hear in these
Richter/Leinsdorf
Kissin/BBC/A.Davis http://youtu.be/ONDMpNhQa1Y
Pollini/VPO/Abbado http://youtu.be/n94vcKmDJwo
Solomon/Philh/Dobrowen http://youtu.be/utcu2xgJqjA
Fleisher/Cleveland/Szell http://youtu.be/93ixZK4urbI
Fischer/BPOFurtwangler 1942 http://youtu.be/-Jbzf-n4LqQ
Rubinstein/BSO/Munch 1952 http://youtu.be/HAPvtE6x9vA
Rubinstein/RAI/Cluytens http://youtu.be/e547XN4QbhE
Horowitz/NBC/Toscanini 1940 http://youtu.be/PwQVgxRvaNE
Rubinstein/Krips.
Any Richter other than with Leinsdorf! ;-)
If good sound is important go with Maazel.
Igor Zhukov
Khatia Buniatishvili
Monique de la Bruchollerie
HJ Lim.

dk
Lawrence Kart
2019-07-21 02:52:25 UTC
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Post by dk
Post by Andy Evans
Post by Andy Evans
Plenty of recordings of this work, but which of them are you most satisfied with?
Provisional list - need to listen to them some more, but I like what I hear in these
Richter/Leinsdorf
Kissin/BBC/A.Davis http://youtu.be/ONDMpNhQa1Y
Pollini/VPO/Abbado http://youtu.be/n94vcKmDJwo
Solomon/Philh/Dobrowen http://youtu.be/utcu2xgJqjA
Fleisher/Cleveland/Szell http://youtu.be/93ixZK4urbI
Fischer/BPOFurtwangler 1942 http://youtu.be/-Jbzf-n4LqQ
Rubinstein/BSO/Munch 1952 http://youtu.be/HAPvtE6x9vA
Rubinstein/RAI/Cluytens http://youtu.be/e547XN4QbhE
Horowitz/NBC/Toscanini 1940 http://youtu.be/PwQVgxRvaNE
Rubinstein/Krips.
Any Richter other than with Leinsdorf! ;-)
If good sound is important go with Maazel.
Igor Zhukov
Khatia Buniatishvili
Monique de la Bruchollerie
HJ Lim.
dk
Thanks to you, Dan, and to YouTube, I'm now a convert to Monique de la Bruchollerie.
Never heard of her before. Zhukov is quite something too, and quite different than de la Bruchollerie, but I think I prefer her if I have to chose.

LK
dk
2019-07-21 07:33:48 UTC
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Thanks to you, Dan, and to YouTube, I'm now a
convert to Monique de la Bruchollerie.
Glad you liked her. She was sometimes
referred to as "Mme. Richter"!

dk
Lawrence Kart
2019-07-21 12:30:33 UTC
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Post by dk
Thanks to you, Dan, and to YouTube, I'm now a
convert to Monique de la Bruchollerie.
Glad you liked her. She was sometimes
referred to as "Mme. Richter"!
dk
Painting with a broad brush, I would characterize Zhukov's performance as leonine and de la Bruchollerie's as tigerish. There's room for both. Again, many thanks for making me aware of these recordings.

LK
dk
2019-07-21 19:02:27 UTC
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Post by Lawrence Kart
Post by dk
Thanks to you, Dan, and to YouTube, I'm now a
convert to Monique de la Bruchollerie.
Glad you liked her. She was sometimes
referred to as "Mme. Richter"!
Painting with a broad brush, I would characterize
Zhukov's performance as leonine and de la Bruchollerie's
as tigerish. There's room for both. Again, many thanks
for making me aware of these recordings.
Then listen to Watts/Bernstein for a leopardish
(leopardine?) performance and to HJ Lim for a
cheetahine (cheetish?) performance! ;-)

And try to find a recording of that Richter
live performance from the Baalbek Festival,
as well as one of Rubinstein's 196x (7? 8?)
performance from the Prague Spring Festival.

dk

dk
dk
2019-07-21 19:07:42 UTC
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Post by dk
Post by Lawrence Kart
Post by dk
Thanks to you, Dan, and to YouTube, I'm now a
convert to Monique de la Bruchollerie.
Glad you liked her. She was sometimes
referred to as "Mme. Richter"!
Painting with a broad brush, I would characterize
Zhukov's performance as leonine and de la Bruchollerie's
as tigerish. There's room for both. Again, many thanks
for making me aware of these recordings.
Then listen to Watts/Bernstein for a leopardish
(leopardine?) performance and to HJ Lim for a
cheetahine (cheetish?) performance! ;-)
And try to find a recording of that Richter
live performance from the Baalbek Festival,
as well as one of Rubinstein's 196x (7? 8?)
performance from the Prague Spring Festival.
Weissenberg not bad either:


dk
dk
2019-07-21 19:53:14 UTC
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Post by dk
Post by dk
Post by Lawrence Kart
Post by dk
Thanks to you, Dan, and to YouTube, I'm now a
convert to Monique de la Bruchollerie.
Glad you liked her. She was sometimes
referred to as "Mme. Richter"!
Painting with a broad brush, I would characterize
Zhukov's performance as leonine and de la Bruchollerie's
as tigerish. There's room for both. Again, many thanks
for making me aware of these recordings.
Then listen to Watts/Bernstein for a leopardish
(leopardine?) performance and to HJ Lim for a
cheetahine (cheetish?) performance! ;-)
And try to find a recording of that Richter
live performance from the Baalbek Festival,
as well as one of Rubinstein's 196x (7? 8?)
performance from the Prague Spring Festival.
http://youtu.be/hR6RSlSTKlQ
Or Schnabel!


dk
Frank Berger
2019-07-21 19:14:43 UTC
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Post by dk
Post by Lawrence Kart
Post by dk
Thanks to you, Dan, and to YouTube, I'm now a
convert to Monique de la Bruchollerie.
Glad you liked her. She was sometimes
referred to as "Mme. Richter"!
Painting with a broad brush, I would characterize
Zhukov's performance as leonine and de la Bruchollerie's
as tigerish. There's room for both. Again, many thanks
for making me aware of these recordings.
Then listen to Watts/Bernstein for a leopardish
(leopardine?) performance and to HJ Lim for a
cheetahine (cheetish?) performance! ;-)
And try to find a recording of that Richter
live performance from the Baalbek Festival,
as well as one of Rubinstein's 196x (7? 8?)
performance from the Prague Spring Festival.
dk
dk
Did I not point you to the right one earlier in the thread?
dk
2019-07-21 19:31:22 UTC
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Post by Frank Berger
Post by dk
Post by Lawrence Kart
Post by dk
Thanks to you, Dan, and to YouTube, I'm now a
convert to Monique de la Bruchollerie.
Glad you liked her. She was sometimes
referred to as "Mme. Richter"!
Painting with a broad brush, I would characterize
Zhukov's performance as leonine and de la Bruchollerie's
as tigerish. There's room for both. Again, many thanks
for making me aware of these recordings.
Then listen to Watts/Bernstein for a leopardish
(leopardine?) performance and to HJ Lim for a
cheetahine (cheetish?) performance! ;-)
And try to find a recording of that Richter
live performance from the Baalbek Festival,
as well as one of Rubinstein's 196x (7? 8?)
performance from the Prague Spring Festival.
Did I not point you to the right one earlier
in the thread?
?!? Which right one? Neither Rubinstein/Prague
nor Richter/Baalbek are on YouTube. As far as I
recall I never saw any recordings. The reason I
remember them is that both performance were live
broadcast and I heard them on radio. Hopefully
the respective radio stations recorded them as
well -- who knows.

dk
Frank Berger
2019-07-21 20:07:14 UTC
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Post by dk
Post by Frank Berger
Post by dk
Post by Lawrence Kart
Post by dk
Thanks to you, Dan, and to YouTube, I'm now a
convert to Monique de la Bruchollerie.
Glad you liked her. She was sometimes
referred to as "Mme. Richter"!
Painting with a broad brush, I would characterize
Zhukov's performance as leonine and de la Bruchollerie's
as tigerish. There's room for both. Again, many thanks
for making me aware of these recordings.
Then listen to Watts/Bernstein for a leopardish
(leopardine?) performance and to HJ Lim for a
cheetahine (cheetish?) performance! ;-)
And try to find a recording of that Richter
live performance from the Baalbek Festival,
as well as one of Rubinstein's 196x (7? 8?)
performance from the Prague Spring Festival.
Did I not point you to the right one earlier
in the thread?
?!? Which right one? Neither Rubinstein/Prague
nor Richter/Baalbek are on YouTube. As far as I
recall I never saw any recordings. The reason I
remember them is that both performance were live
broadcast and I heard them on radio. Hopefully
the respective radio stations recorded them as
well -- who knows.
dk
Richter/Maazel:



https://tinyurl.com/y5ktjw88
dk
2019-07-21 20:15:00 UTC
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Post by Frank Berger
Post by dk
Post by Frank Berger
Post by dk
Post by Lawrence Kart
Post by dk
Thanks to you, Dan, and to YouTube, I'm now a
convert to Monique de la Bruchollerie.
Glad you liked her. She was sometimes
referred to as "Mme. Richter"!
Painting with a broad brush, I would characterize
Zhukov's performance as leonine and de la Bruchollerie's
as tigerish. There's room for both. Again, many thanks
for making me aware of these recordings.
Then listen to Watts/Bernstein for a leopardish
(leopardine?) performance and to HJ Lim for a
cheetahine (cheetish?) performance! ;-)
And try to find a recording of that Richter
live performance from the Baalbek Festival,
as well as one of Rubinstein's 196x (7? 8?)
performance from the Prague Spring Festival.
Did I not point you to the right one earlier
in the thread?
?!? Which right one? Neither Rubinstein/Prague
nor Richter/Baalbek are on YouTube. As far as I
recall I never saw any recordings. The reason I
remember them is that both performance were live
broadcast and I heard them on radio. Hopefully
the respective radio stations recorded them as
well -- who knows.
https://tinyurl.com/y5ktjw88
That is a studio recording from around the same time.
It is most definitely NOT the live performance from
the Baalbek Festival!

dk
Frank Berger
2019-07-21 21:00:49 UTC
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Post by dk
Post by Frank Berger
Post by dk
Post by Frank Berger
Post by dk
Post by Lawrence Kart
Post by dk
Thanks to you, Dan, and to YouTube, I'm now a
convert to Monique de la Bruchollerie.
Glad you liked her. She was sometimes
referred to as "Mme. Richter"!
Painting with a broad brush, I would characterize
Zhukov's performance as leonine and de la Bruchollerie's
as tigerish. There's room for both. Again, many thanks
for making me aware of these recordings.
Then listen to Watts/Bernstein for a leopardish
(leopardine?) performance and to HJ Lim for a
cheetahine (cheetish?) performance! ;-)
And try to find a recording of that Richter
live performance from the Baalbek Festival,
as well as one of Rubinstein's 196x (7? 8?)
performance from the Prague Spring Festival.
Did I not point you to the right one earlier
in the thread?
?!? Which right one? Neither Rubinstein/Prague
nor Richter/Baalbek are on YouTube. As far as I
recall I never saw any recordings. The reason I
remember them is that both performance were live
broadcast and I heard them on radio. Hopefully
the respective radio stations recorded them as
well -- who knows.
https://tinyurl.com/y5ktjw88
That is a studio recording from around the same time.
It is most definitely NOT the live performance from
the Baalbek Festival!
dk
OK.
JohnGavin
2019-07-21 23:53:28 UTC
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The classic Gilels / Reiner has long been a reference recording for me.

I found the Zimerman/ Bernstein on DG enjoyable largely due to the fine piano playing - which might strike some as too refined and not muscular enough for this music.
y***@gmail.com
2019-07-23 19:29:10 UTC
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Post by Lawrence Kart
Post by dk
Thanks to you, Dan, and to YouTube, I'm now a
convert to Monique de la Bruchollerie.
Glad you liked her. She was sometimes
referred to as "Mme. Richter"!
dk
Painting with a broad brush, I would characterize Zhukov's performance as leonine and de la Bruchollerie's as tigerish. There's room for both. Again, many thanks for making me aware of these recordings.
LK
Thank you, Dan and Lawrence. I've admired Zhukov for a long time but had never heard his Brahms - loved it! I had never heard of Monique de La Bruchollerie - what a fabulous performance!! Thanks again.
Bozo
2019-07-22 13:36:36 UTC
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Heard just the first movs.( for me, first, last movs. most difficult to bring off well ),YT's of Zhukov,Bruchollerie,HJ Lim( live).My first hearings of these, thanks Dan,Lawrence.Zhukov is the one I'll go back to hear complete to see if I add his to my Gilels/Reiner,Backhaus/Bohm 1967,Rubinstein/Cluytens pantheon.
Andy Evans
2019-07-22 15:24:50 UTC
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Post by Bozo
Heard just the first movs.( for me, first, last movs. most difficult to bring off well ),YT's of Zhukov,Bruchollerie,HJ Lim( live).My first hearings of these, thanks Dan,Lawrence.Zhukov is the one I'll go back to hear complete to see if I add his to my Gilels/Reiner,Backhaus/Bohm 1967,Rubinstein/Cluytens pantheon.
Yes - Zhukov is good isn't he? In my top 5 with Rubinstein (Cluytens and Munch), Kissin, Fleisher and Pollini/VPO/Abbado. Not a definitive top 5 - keeps shifting around as I listen more. What I've given up on are the more "emphatic", and sometimes piano-forward readings of Gilels, Richter, Serkin, Zimerman, Arrau and many others, Gelber being the worst. I want a more Brahmsian mellowness and some degree of charm as well, plus a sound balance that allows plenty of body and detail in the orchestra. Still searching for a fully satisfying reading.
Dave B.
2019-07-22 16:16:06 UTC
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Post by Andy Evans
Post by Bozo
Heard just the first movs.( for me, first, last movs. most difficult to bring off well ),YT's of Zhukov,Bruchollerie,HJ Lim( live).My first hearings of these, thanks Dan,Lawrence.Zhukov is the one I'll go back to hear complete to see if I add his to my Gilels/Reiner,Backhaus/Bohm 1967,Rubinstein/Cluytens pantheon.
Yes - Zhukov is good isn't he? In my top 5 with Rubinstein (Cluytens and Munch), Kissin, Fleisher and Pollini/VPO/Abbado. Not a definitive top 5 - keeps shifting around as I listen more. What I've given up on are the more "emphatic", and sometimes piano-forward readings of Gilels, Richter, Serkin, Zimerman, Arrau and many others, Gelber being the worst. I want a more Brahmsian mellowness and some degree of charm as well, plus a sound balance that allows plenty of body and detail in the orchestra. Still searching for a fully satisfying reading.
Where is Cliburn/Reiner? Did I miss it?
Andy Evans
2019-07-22 16:39:24 UTC
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Post by Dave B.
Where is Cliburn/Reiner? Did I miss it?
I don't think this has been discussed. It has plenty to recommend it - realistic balance with the orchestra, good piano tone, nice recording generally. I personally don't find enough character in it to lift it above just a good performance that does little wrong. But even that puts it at least in the middle of the pack or higher.
Bozo
2019-07-22 17:37:27 UTC
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I want a more Brahmsian mellowness and some degree of charm as well, plus a sound balance that allows >plenty of body and detail in the orchestra. Still searching for a fully satisfying reading.
Hard to tell balances with YT sound, not sure this meets your search criteria, but I always enjoy the warmth in Nelson Freire's Brahms playing , although not as much character as some , here with Chailly,Leipzig Gewandhaus, a 2006 Decca cd I believe:


Andy Evans
2019-07-22 21:39:02 UTC
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Post by Bozo
http://youtu.be/NfCxsC39-60
Thanks - I have a lot of respect for Friere. I came across Murray Perahia with Bavarian RSO/Maazel 1998 live, and I enjoyed it more than I expected. Fairly middle of the road but nice playing and good recording balance and sound. Engaging enough for me to listen to the whole of the 1st movement on YT. I may go back to it.
y***@gmail.com
2019-07-23 01:50:55 UTC
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Post by Andy Evans
Post by Bozo
http://youtu.be/NfCxsC39-60
Thanks - I have a lot of respect for Friere. I came across Murray Perahia with Bavarian RSO/Maazel 1998 live, and I enjoyed it more than I expected. Fairly middle of the road but nice playing and good recording balance and sound. Engaging enough for me to listen to the whole of the 1st movement on YT. I may go back to it.
Thank you, Andy. I didn't know that this Perahia performance existed, or that this concerto was even in his repertoire - but it's not surprising, considering that he was a Serkin pupil. I wonder when he first played it, (or whether he also played the First Concerto as well) - too bad there isn't a studio recording - again, I wonder why, considering that he did record other Brahms. In any event, I enjoyed it very much...
dk
2019-07-21 07:40:54 UTC
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Post by dk
Post by Andy Evans
Post by Andy Evans
Plenty of recordings of this work, but which of them are you most satisfied with?
Provisional list - need to listen to them some more, but I like what I hear in these
Richter/Leinsdorf
Kissin/BBC/A.Davis http://youtu.be/ONDMpNhQa1Y
Pollini/VPO/Abbado http://youtu.be/n94vcKmDJwo
Solomon/Philh/Dobrowen http://youtu.be/utcu2xgJqjA
Fleisher/Cleveland/Szell http://youtu.be/93ixZK4urbI
Fischer/BPOFurtwangler 1942 http://youtu.be/-Jbzf-n4LqQ
Rubinstein/BSO/Munch 1952 http://youtu.be/HAPvtE6x9vA
Rubinstein/RAI/Cluytens http://youtu.be/e547XN4QbhE
Horowitz/NBC/Toscanini 1940 http://youtu.be/PwQVgxRvaNE
Rubinstein/Krips.
Any Richter other than with Leinsdorf! ;-)
If good sound is important go with Maazel.
Igor Zhukov
Khatia Buniatishvili
Monique de la Bruchollerie
HJ Lim.
I also liked Katchen in this concerto.

dk
dk
2019-07-21 08:14:56 UTC
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Post by dk
Post by dk
Post by Andy Evans
Post by Andy Evans
Plenty of recordings of this work, but which of them are you most satisfied with?
Provisional list - need to listen to them some more, but I like what I hear in these
Richter/Leinsdorf
Kissin/BBC/A.Davis http://youtu.be/ONDMpNhQa1Y
Pollini/VPO/Abbado http://youtu.be/n94vcKmDJwo
Solomon/Philh/Dobrowen http://youtu.be/utcu2xgJqjA
Fleisher/Cleveland/Szell http://youtu.be/93ixZK4urbI
Fischer/BPOFurtwangler 1942 http://youtu.be/-Jbzf-n4LqQ
Rubinstein/BSO/Munch 1952 http://youtu.be/HAPvtE6x9vA
Rubinstein/RAI/Cluytens http://youtu.be/e547XN4QbhE
Horowitz/NBC/Toscanini 1940 http://youtu.be/PwQVgxRvaNE
Rubinstein/Krips.
Any Richter other than with Leinsdorf! ;-)
If good sound is important go with Maazel.
Igor Zhukov
Khatia Buniatishvili
Monique de la Bruchollerie
HJ Lim.
I also liked Katchen in this concerto.
And I like HJ Lim's fluidity and enthusiasm!

dk
Andy Evans
2019-07-21 10:11:53 UTC
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Post by dk
And I like HJ Lim's fluidity and enthusiasm!
dk
HJ Lim is new to me - absolutely fascinating person and pianist. Quite magnetic to watch. The longest hair of any pianist I've ever seen. I'm a fan and will be checking out more of her work. Not sure what to make of this excerpt from her website:

"Plato, Dostoyevsky, Poulenc and Chopin are part of her intellectual bulimia...."
Lawrence Kart
2019-07-20 22:28:12 UTC
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Post by Andy Evans
Plenty of recordings of this work, but which of them are you most satisfied with?
Bruno Leonardo Gelber
dk
2019-07-20 22:52:18 UTC
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Post by Lawrence Kart
Post by Andy Evans
Plenty of recordings of this work, but
which of them are you most satisfied with?
Bruno Leonardo Gelber
Label/date?

dk
Lawrence Kart
2019-07-20 23:27:51 UTC
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Post by dk
Post by Lawrence Kart
Post by Andy Evans
Plenty of recordings of this work, but
which of them are you most satisfied with?
Bruno Leonardo Gelber
Label/date?
dk
I have it on a 1975 Connoisseur Society/Pathe Marconi/EMI LP reissue. The recording, with Kempe and the Royal Philharmonic, was made for EMI, probably circa 1966, the same year Gelber recorded Brahms 1 with the Munich Philharmonic under Franz-Paul Decker. The Gelber Brahms 2 is available on a 2005 EMI reissue.

LK
dk
2019-07-20 23:39:26 UTC
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Post by Lawrence Kart
Post by dk
Post by Lawrence Kart
Post by Andy Evans
Plenty of recordings of this work, but
which of them are you most satisfied with?
Bruno Leonardo Gelber
Label/date?
I have it on a 1975 Connoisseur Society/Pathe
Marconi/EMI LP reissue. The recording, with
Kempe and the Royal Philharmonic, was made
for EMI, probably circa 1966, the same year
Gelber recorded Brahms 1 with the Munich
Philharmonic under Franz-Paul Decker. The
Gelber Brahms 2 is available on a 2005 EMI
reissue.
Thanks!

dk
Bozo
2019-07-20 23:13:00 UTC
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Post by Lawrence Kart
Bruno Leonardo Gelber
Thanks for the reference to Gelber. Is this 2003 live Gelber the one to which you refer?



Regardless, the 2003 is very fine. For my taste , I believe there is more emotional contrast in the work than Gelber displays.
dk
2019-07-20 23:44:21 UTC
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Post by Bozo
Post by Lawrence Kart
Bruno Leonardo Gelber
Thanks for the reference to Gelber. Is this
2003 live Gelber the one to which you refer?
http://youtu.be/tnlc1qTjnT0
Regardless, the 2003 is very fine. For my
taste , I believe there is more emotional
contrast in the work than Gelber displays.
Better live performance from 1992 sounds
more lively and with fewer mistakes:



dk
dk
2019-07-21 00:01:30 UTC
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Post by dk
Post by Bozo
Post by Lawrence Kart
Bruno Leonardo Gelber
Thanks for the reference to Gelber. Is this
2003 live Gelber the one to which you refer?
http://youtu.be/tnlc1qTjnT0
Regardless, the 2003 is very fine. For my
taste , I believe there is more emotional
contrast in the work than Gelber displays.
Better live performance from 1992 sounds
http://youtu.be/3DrxnoT5EIY
BTW I find Gelber ponderous and uninspired in
the Brahms 2nd. He plays it i pretty much the
same way he plays the first! He does not get
Brahms' lighter side at all!

dk
c***@gmail.com
2019-07-21 13:04:30 UTC
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Post by dk
Post by dk
Post by Bozo
Post by Lawrence Kart
Bruno Leonardo Gelber
Thanks for the reference to Gelber. Is this
2003 live Gelber the one to which you refer?
http://youtu.be/tnlc1qTjnT0
Regardless, the 2003 is very fine. For my
taste , I believe there is more emotional
contrast in the work than Gelber displays.
Better live performance from 1992 sounds
http://youtu.be/3DrxnoT5EIY
BTW I find Gelber ponderous and uninspired in
the Brahms 2nd. He plays it i pretty much the
same way he plays the first! He does not get
Brahms' lighter side at all!
dk
I agree with Dan; Gelber's #1 is light years ahead of his #2. "Ponderous" is a word that applies to most recordings of #2 that I've heard, the sacred cows Gilels/Jochum (far inferior to Gilels/Reiner) and Solomon/Dobrowen being two cases in point. Over the years it has surprised me how much I enjoy Arrau in this work, although I certainly understand why others don't. I should have mentioned Zhukov and thank Dan for bringing him up.

AC
Frank Berger
2019-07-21 13:52:02 UTC
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Post by c***@gmail.com
Post by dk
Post by dk
Post by Bozo
Post by Lawrence Kart
Bruno Leonardo Gelber
Thanks for the reference to Gelber. Is this
2003 live Gelber the one to which you refer?
http://youtu.be/tnlc1qTjnT0
Regardless, the 2003 is very fine. For my
taste , I believe there is more emotional
contrast in the work than Gelber displays.
Better live performance from 1992 sounds
http://youtu.be/3DrxnoT5EIY
BTW I find Gelber ponderous and uninspired in
the Brahms 2nd. He plays it i pretty much the
same way he plays the first! He does not get
Brahms' lighter side at all!
dk
I agree with Dan; Gelber's #1 is light years ahead of his #2. "Ponderous" is a word that applies to most recordings of #2 that I've heard, the sacred cows Gilels/Jochum (far inferior to Gilels/Reiner) and Solomon/Dobrowen being two cases in point. Over the years it has surprised me how much I enjoy Arrau in this work, although I certainly understand why others don't. I should have mentioned Zhukov and thank Dan for bringing him up.
AC
Has anyone mentioned De Larrocha (Jochum)
number_six
2019-07-21 17:10:20 UTC
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Post by Frank Berger
Post by c***@gmail.com
Post by dk
Post by dk
Post by Bozo
Post by Lawrence Kart
Bruno Leonardo Gelber
Thanks for the reference to Gelber. Is this
2003 live Gelber the one to which you refer?
http://youtu.be/tnlc1qTjnT0
Regardless, the 2003 is very fine. For my
taste , I believe there is more emotional
contrast in the work than Gelber displays.
Better live performance from 1992 sounds
http://youtu.be/3DrxnoT5EIY
BTW I find Gelber ponderous and uninspired in
the Brahms 2nd. He plays it i pretty much the
same way he plays the first! He does not get
Brahms' lighter side at all!
dk
I agree with Dan; Gelber's #1 is light years ahead of his #2. "Ponderous" is a word that applies to most recordings of #2 that I've heard, the sacred cows Gilels/Jochum (far inferior to Gilels/Reiner) and Solomon/Dobrowen being two cases in point. Over the years it has surprised me how much I enjoy Arrau in this work, although I certainly understand why others don't. I should have mentioned Zhukov and thank Dan for bringing him up.
AC
Has anyone mentioned De Larrocha (Jochum)
I think Bachauer may be the only one in my collection
Andy Evans
2019-07-21 17:38:21 UTC
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Got round to Zhukov, De Larrocha and De La Bruchollerie, and of those I'll take the Zhukov - nice performance. Now starting on what I can find of the Richters, beginning with the 1958 Moscow one under Georgescu on YT.....
Frank Berger
2019-07-21 19:16:15 UTC
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Post by Andy Evans
Got round to Zhukov, De Larrocha and De La Bruchollerie, and of those I'll take the Zhukov - nice performance. Now starting on what I can find of the Richters, beginning with the 1958 Moscow one under Georgescu on YT.....
Do you know when Zhukov/Rozhdestvensky was recorded?
dk
2019-07-21 19:26:10 UTC
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Post by Frank Berger
Post by Andy Evans
Got round to Zhukov, De Larrocha and De La
Bruchollerie, and of those I'll take the
Zhukov - nice performance. Now starting
on what I can find of the Richters,
beginning with the 1958 Moscow one
under Georgescu on YT.....
Do you know when Zhukov/Rozhdestvensky was
recorded?
Probably early or mid '70s.

dk
graham
2019-07-21 18:35:53 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Frank Berger
Post by c***@gmail.com
Post by dk
Post by dk
Post by Bozo
Post by Lawrence Kart
Bruno Leonardo Gelber
Thanks for the reference to Gelber. Is this
2003 live Gelber the one to which you refer?
http://youtu.be/tnlc1qTjnT0
Regardless,  the 2003 is very fine. For my
taste , I believe there is more emotional
contrast in the work than Gelber displays.
Better live performance from 1992 sounds
http://youtu.be/3DrxnoT5EIY
BTW I find Gelber ponderous and uninspired in
the Brahms 2nd. He plays it i pretty much the
same way he plays the first! He does not get
Brahms' lighter side at all!
dk
I agree with Dan; Gelber's #1 is light years ahead of his #2.
"Ponderous" is a word that applies to most recordings of #2 that I've
heard, the sacred cows Gilels/Jochum (far inferior to Gilels/Reiner)
and Solomon/Dobrowen being two cases in point.  Over the years it has
surprised me how much I enjoy Arrau in this work, although I certainly
understand why others don't.  I should have mentioned Zhukov and thank
Dan for bringing him up.
AC
Has anyone mentioned De Larrocha (Jochum)
Or the more recent Freire?
AB
2019-07-21 00:41:14 UTC
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Post by Lawrence Kart
Post by Andy Evans
Plenty of recordings of this work, but which of them are you most satisfied with?
Bruno Leonardo Gelber
and his Brahms 1st pc.......even more impressive

AB
Lawrence Chalmers
2019-07-21 00:54:25 UTC
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Post by Andy Evans
Plenty of recordings of this work, but which of them are you most satisfied with?
What's so objectionable about Richter/Leinsdorf?
dk
2019-07-21 07:15:08 UTC
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Post by Lawrence Chalmers
What's so objectionable about Richter/Leinsdorf?
Having heard Richter perform it live
several times, the performance with
Leinsdorf does not sound to my ears
as authoritative and coherent as
Richter's other readings of the
work.

Richter did not like it either. He
wanted to record the concerto with
Reiner. Leinsdorf stepped in at the
last moment as Reiner was indisposed.

Personally, I would pick Maazel and
one of the earlier 1950s recordings.

dk
dk
2019-07-21 07:38:16 UTC
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Post by Lawrence Chalmers
Post by Andy Evans
Plenty of recordings of this work, but which of them are you most satisfied with?
What's so objectionable about Richter/Leinsdorf?
Here's the list of Richter's Brahms 2nd recorded
performances:

- Kyrill Kondrashin conducting Czech Philharmonic Orchestra
- George Georgescu conducting Bucharest George Enescu Philharmonic Orchestra
- Charles Munch conducting Boston Symphony Orchestra
- Mario Rossi conducting Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della RAI
- Kurt Sanderling conducting USSR State Orchestra
- Lorin Maazel conducting Orchestre de Paris
- Erich Leinsdorf conducting Chicago Symphony Orchestra
- Evgeny Mravinsky conducting Leningrad Philharmonic Orchestra
- George Georgescu conducting USSR State Symphony Orchestra
- Kyrill Kondrashin conducting Moscow Philharmonic Orchestra
- Andras Korodi conducting Hungarian State Orchestra
- Witold Rowicki conducting Orchestre National de la ORTF

IMHO the one with Leinsdorf is the least good of the lot!

Missing from this list is a live performance with
Maazel and ODP from one of the Baalbek Festivals
in Lebanon, dating from the late 1960s or early
1970s. I heard it on the radio as it happened.
I don't know if a recording exists, and I would
probably kill to have it! He played the entire
concerto again as an encore!

dk
Frank Berger
2019-07-21 12:11:09 UTC
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Post by dk
Post by Lawrence Chalmers
Post by Andy Evans
Plenty of recordings of this work, but which of them are you most satisfied with?
What's so objectionable about Richter/Leinsdorf?
Here's the list of Richter's Brahms 2nd recorded
- Kyrill Kondrashin conducting Czech Philharmonic Orchestra
- George Georgescu conducting Bucharest George Enescu Philharmonic Orchestra
- Charles Munch conducting Boston Symphony Orchestra
- Mario Rossi conducting Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della RAI
- Kurt Sanderling conducting USSR State Orchestra
- Lorin Maazel conducting Orchestre de Paris
- Erich Leinsdorf conducting Chicago Symphony Orchestra
- Evgeny Mravinsky conducting Leningrad Philharmonic Orchestra
- George Georgescu conducting USSR State Symphony Orchestra
- Kyrill Kondrashin conducting Moscow Philharmonic Orchestra
- Andras Korodi conducting Hungarian State Orchestra
- Witold Rowicki conducting Orchestre National de la ORTF
IMHO the one with Leinsdorf is the least good of the lot!
Missing from this list is a live performance with
Maazel and ODP from one of the Baalbek Festivals
in Lebanon, dating from the late 1960s or early
1970s. I heard it on the radio as it happened.
I don't know if a recording exists, and I would
probably kill to have it! He played the entire
concerto again as an encore!
dk
https://tinyurl.com/y5ktjw88
c***@gmail.com
2019-07-21 01:04:37 UTC
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Post by Andy Evans
Plenty of recordings of this work, but which of them are you most satisfied with?
The live video with Yuja Wang and Gergiev from 2018 in Munich, on YouTube.
Frank Lekens
2019-07-21 09:31:46 UTC
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Post by Andy Evans
Plenty of recordings of this work, but which of them are you most satisfied with?
Tom Service here makes a good case for Zimerman/Bernstein, which he made
me listen to more attentively than I'd previously done, apparently,
since I can see why he opts for that -- while discussing quite a few
others along the way:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p073p44t

I heard Zimerman play it live in Amsterdam a few years ago, I certainly
enjoyed that a lot.
--
Frank Lekens

http://fmlekens.home.xs4all.nl/
https://franklekens.blogspot.nl/
m***@gmail.com
2019-07-21 17:44:03 UTC
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Post by Andy Evans
Plenty of recordings of this work, but which of them are you most satisfied with?
Rubinstein/Krips/RCA Victor Symphony Orch
Fleisher/Szell/Cleveland
Richter-Haaser/Karajan/Berlin
Backhaus/Böhm/VPO ('60s)
Bozo
2019-07-21 19:46:49 UTC
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Very good performance ( to my ears ) of the 2nd Concerto in 2-piano format, original solo part, orchestral reduction , live video :



Someone forgot to tell these youngsters how difficult this work is supposed to seem.

From the YT:

Israeli pianist Rafael Skorka performs Brahms' Piano Concerto no. 2 in B-flat major, op. 83.
Second piano - Michael Zartsekel.

Recording and video: Eyal Zaliouk / The Classical Studio.
Filmed at the Aviv Competitions, Recanati Auditorium, Tel-Aviv Museum of Art, 2014.
y***@gmail.com
2019-07-23 08:20:29 UTC
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Post by Andy Evans
Plenty of recordings of this work, but which of them are you most satisfied with?
One of my favorite performances is by John Lill, recorded live at the Tchaikovsky Competition, Moscow, June 25, 1970. It was released on Heliodor / Deutsche Grammophon in 1971:



It finally appeared on CD in 2016 on the Eloquence label:

https://tinyurl.com/y68tod63
AB
2019-07-23 18:23:00 UTC
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Post by y***@gmail.com
Post by Andy Evans
Plenty of recordings of this work, but which of them are you most satisfied with?
http://youtu.be/aQRkh8xNwGw
https://tinyurl.com/y68tod63
how come nobody (or did I miss it) mention Horowitz, especially with Toscanini live in 1948. the alternating octaves at the end of the first movement. incredible sounds that I have never heard before

AB
r***@verizon.net
2019-07-24 15:34:37 UTC
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Post by AB
how come nobody (or did I miss it) mention Horowitz, especially with Toscanini live in 1948. the alternating octaves at the end of the first movement. incredible sounds that I have never heard before
AB
I agree it's a great performance but not well-known. And the sound is vastly better than the live and studio recordings of 1940. It also marks the last time Horowitz performed with Toscanini. As far as I know it never appeared on any of (what I consider) the better historic labels such as Music and Arts, Naxos, Immortal Performances, or Guild. It is available on Pristine Classical but I haven't heard their restoration. I have it on old Stradivarius CD.
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