Discussion:
Shostakovich 9, RAI Symphony/Klemperer, Turin 1956
(too old to reply)
GP49
2010-04-06 05:21:55 UTC
Permalink
Shostakovich: Symphony No. 9
RAI Symphony Orchestra
Otto Klemperer, conductor
Live broadcast concert

http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=44dea677a83d2311111096d429abd3607274d1436d3c638882e3a934329c7a5e

OR, if you don't like how long links get displayed in abbreviated form
on some message readers:

http://tinyurl.com/yaep4xy

From a mint-condition Fonit Cetra LP

Three FLACs, mono. Tracks are divided the same as on the source LP,
with Movements 3, 4 and 5 in one track.

--------------------------------------------------------------

Otto Klemperer is not exactly the first conductor one associates with
composer Dmitri Shostakovich.

Klemperer never commercially recorded Shostakovich but a radio
broadcast
documents his live concert performance of the Shostakovich Symphony
No.
9 with the RAI Symphony Orchestra in Turin on 21 DEC 1956. This
recording has been issued intermittenly on various labels (which
misdate
it as "1955"); but it does not appear to be currently available.

Musicweb International, in its website, compares Klemperer's
...Barshai proved that a Russian could be perfectly idiomatic in
Mozart and Beethoven. After his move to the west in 1976 Barshai has
won a lot of respect without ever quite making it to the top. The
booklet profile (from a commercial issue of Barshai's Shostakovich
cycle), taking up a comment by Shostakovich about Barshai’s "Eroica",
states that his "music-making could most easily be compared to
Klemperer’s".
Easily said, when Klemperer recordings of Shostakovich are not
exactly two-a-penny. But wait, there is one, so let’s examine the two
conductors in Shostakovich’s 9th Symphony. Klemperer’s 1955 Turin
performance of this work used to be available on a Cetra LP and is
occasionally re-broadcast by the RAI; we may hope that one day a
re-mastering of the original tapes will produce a less scrawny sound
than that of the off-the-air tape I am working from. At the outset
Klemperer is so much slower than Barshai that it seems ridiculous,
but then you realise that he is thoroughly enjoying the droll humour
of it all, and he gets bouncier rhythms and cheekier phrasing. It
sounds closer to Kurt Weill’s pre-war Berlin than to post-war
Shostakovich, but it has character and I’m afraid Barshai’s neat
reading sounds merely bland in comparison. Klemperer also gets a
weird mixture of beauty and sleaze out of the second movement and in
the third movement, where he is scarcely slower than Barshai, the
players sound possessed where Barshai’s are no more than spick and
span. By this time Klemperer has the Turiners absolutely under his
thumb. The brass in the fourth movement blow raspberries in a way
Barshai does not even attempt and the Turin bassoonist is momentarily
transformed into the greatest bassoonist in the world as Klemperer
coaxes a saxophone-like whine and some bilious rubato from him. And
in the finale Klemperer, at a faster tempo than Barshai, again revels
in the cheekiness of the music.
don’t make comparisons that risk blowing up in your face! Barshai is
a very fine conductor but a great conductor is another thing and
Klemperer, even in music for which he presumably had only a passing
interest, was unmistakably that.
-MusicWeb International article:

http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2002/July02/Shostakovich_Barshai.htm
Christopher Howell
2010-04-06 12:37:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by GP49
Shostakovich: Symphony No. 9
RAI Symphony Orchestra
Otto Klemperer, conductor
Live broadcast concert
Otto Klemperer is not exactly the first conductor one associates with
composer Dmitri Shostakovich.
Klemperer never commercially recorded Shostakovich but a radio
broadcast
documents his live concert performance of the Shostakovich Symphony
No.
9 with the RAI Symphony Orchestra in Turin on 21 DEC 1956.  This
recording has been issued intermittenly on various labels (which
misdate
it as "1955"); but it does not appear to be currently available.
Musicweb International, in its website, compares Klemperer's
As the author of the MusicWeb piece you quote I am grateful to have
had the opportunity to compare your LP transfer with my off-air
version (recorded on cassette from a broadcast in the 1990s, burnt
onto CDR a few years ago). In spite of the obvious disadvantages of
this process I hear a slightly more open sound on my transfer. RAI
have by now put all their more important archive items on digital
support which is likely to be much better than the over-filtered Cetra
LPs if only it could be made officially available.

Re the correct date, what is your source for this? RAI themselves
announced it as 21 December 1955 (and the same date for Stravinsky
Pulcinella and Strauss Till Eulenspiegel) and they should know, though
I suppose if their own catalogue is mistaken this would account for
others having repeated the mistake over the years. From 17 December
1956 is a concert including Beethoven 1 and Schubert 8.I must say it
seems unlikely two different programmes were played only five days
apart since the Turin concerts were always held weekly and I'd tend to
believe RAI's own dating unless you have conclusivce evidence that
it's wrong.

Chris Howell
TareeDawg
2010-04-06 13:04:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Christopher Howell
Post by GP49
Shostakovich: Symphony No. 9
RAI Symphony Orchestra
Otto Klemperer, conductor
Live broadcast concert
Otto Klemperer is not exactly the first conductor one associates with
composer Dmitri Shostakovich.
Klemperer never commercially recorded Shostakovich but a radio
broadcast
documents his live concert performance of the Shostakovich Symphony
No.
9 with the RAI Symphony Orchestra in Turin on 21 DEC 1956. This
recording has been issued intermittenly on various labels (which
misdate
it as "1955"); but it does not appear to be currently available.
Musicweb International, in its website, compares Klemperer's
As the author of the MusicWeb piece you quote I am grateful to have
had the opportunity to compare your LP transfer with my off-air
version (recorded on cassette from a broadcast in the 1990s, burnt
onto CDR a few years ago). In spite of the obvious disadvantages of
this process I hear a slightly more open sound on my transfer. RAI
have by now put all their more important archive items on digital
support which is likely to be much better than the over-filtered Cetra
LPs if only it could be made officially available.
Re the correct date, what is your source for this? RAI themselves
announced it as 21 December 1955 (and the same date for Stravinsky
Pulcinella and Strauss Till Eulenspiegel) and they should know, though
I suppose if their own catalogue is mistaken this would account for
others having repeated the mistake over the years. From 17 December
1956 is a concert including Beethoven 1 and Schubert 8.I must say it
seems unlikely two different programmes were played only five days
apart since the Turin concerts were always held weekly and I'd tend to
believe RAI's own dating unless you have conclusivce evidence that
it's wrong.
Chris Howell
This concert took place on Dec 21st 1956 in Turin.

I have the whole concert on cassette. Also from the concert on my
cassette is Till Eulenspiegel, Pulcinella Suite (1949) and Haydn's
symphony 101 The Clock.

The first movement of the Shosty 9 is how I expect it to go. Wonderful
performance by Klemps at his considerable peak. The tape was copied from
a Fonit Cetra recording LAR37.

Ray Hall, Taree
GP49
2010-04-06 14:22:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by TareeDawg
This concert took place on Dec 21st 1956 in Turin.
I have the whole concert on cassette. Also from the concert on my
cassette is Till Eulenspiegel, Pulcinella Suite (1949) and Haydn's
symphony 101 The Clock.
The first movement of the Shosty 9 is how I expect it to go. Wonderful
performance by Klemps at his considerable peak. The tape was copied from
a Fonit Cetra recording LAR37.
Fonit Cetra LAR37, I believe, is a three-LP set with several Klemperer
concert performances in Italy from the same timeframe. The LP I
transferred is labeled as part of LAR37; the Shostakovich 9 is Side 6;
other side of the LP is Side 5, Pulcinella Suite. I may be able to
get the rest of the LP set. If so, hopefully it will be in the same
fine condition as this LP.

As for RAI's digital archive of their broadcasts, wouldn't the
digitalization make them "new" recordings and thus subject to
copyright for decades into the future; while (at least in Europe) the
original analog recordings would now be public domain? Perhaps someday
they may become interested enough to make a CD or downloadable issue
of these and other fine concerts in their library. The sound on the
Fonit Cetra LP is definitely heavily filtered; there appears to be
nothing above 8KHz on the LP.
TareeDawg
2010-04-06 14:49:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by GP49
Post by TareeDawg
This concert took place on Dec 21st 1956 in Turin.
I have the whole concert on cassette. Also from the concert on my
cassette is Till Eulenspiegel, Pulcinella Suite (1949) and Haydn's
symphony 101 The Clock.
The first movement of the Shosty 9 is how I expect it to go. Wonderful
performance by Klemps at his considerable peak. The tape was copied from
a Fonit Cetra recording LAR37.
Fonit Cetra LAR37, I believe, is a three-LP set with several Klemperer
concert performances in Italy from the same timeframe. The LP I
transferred is labeled as part of LAR37; the Shostakovich 9 is Side 6;
other side of the LP is Side 5, Pulcinella Suite. I may be able to
get the rest of the LP set. If so, hopefully it will be in the same
fine condition as this LP.
As for RAI's digital archive of their broadcasts, wouldn't the
digitalization make them "new" recordings and thus subject to
copyright for decades into the future; while (at least in Europe) the
original analog recordings would now be public domain? Perhaps someday
they may become interested enough to make a CD or downloadable issue
of these and other fine concerts in their library. The sound on the
Fonit Cetra LP is definitely heavily filtered; there appears to be
nothing above 8KHz on the LP.
As far as I am aware, any digitization of an out-of-copyright recording,
does not infer new copyright entitlements of the performance as such.
But I could be wrong of course.

Ray Hall, Taree
O
2010-04-06 14:56:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by TareeDawg
Post by GP49
Post by TareeDawg
This concert took place on Dec 21st 1956 in Turin.
I have the whole concert on cassette. Also from the concert on my
cassette is Till Eulenspiegel, Pulcinella Suite (1949) and Haydn's
symphony 101 The Clock.
The first movement of the Shosty 9 is how I expect it to go. Wonderful
performance by Klemps at his considerable peak. The tape was copied from
a Fonit Cetra recording LAR37.
Fonit Cetra LAR37, I believe, is a three-LP set with several Klemperer
concert performances in Italy from the same timeframe. The LP I
transferred is labeled as part of LAR37; the Shostakovich 9 is Side 6;
other side of the LP is Side 5, Pulcinella Suite. I may be able to
get the rest of the LP set. If so, hopefully it will be in the same
fine condition as this LP.
As for RAI's digital archive of their broadcasts, wouldn't the
digitalization make them "new" recordings and thus subject to
copyright for decades into the future; while (at least in Europe) the
original analog recordings would now be public domain? Perhaps someday
they may become interested enough to make a CD or downloadable issue
of these and other fine concerts in their library. The sound on the
Fonit Cetra LP is definitely heavily filtered; there appears to be
nothing above 8KHz on the LP.
As far as I am aware, any digitization of an out-of-copyright recording,
does not infer new copyright entitlements of the performance as such.
But I could be wrong of course.
It will depend on the laws of the country, but generally speaking a new
digitization would create a new "publication" of the item, so you
couldn't take the new digitization and create and sell copies. This
new release would not affect the copyright on the original recordings
themselves.

-Owen
Christopher Howell
2010-04-06 19:28:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by O
Post by TareeDawg
Post by GP49
Post by TareeDawg
This concert took place on Dec 21st 1956 in Turin.
I have the whole concert on cassette. Also from the concert on my
cassette is Till Eulenspiegel, Pulcinella Suite (1949) and Haydn's
symphony 101 The Clock.
The first movement of the Shosty 9 is how I expect it to go. Wonderful
performance by Klemps at his considerable peak. The tape was copied from
a Fonit Cetra recording LAR37.
Fonit Cetra LAR37, I believe, is a three-LP set with several Klemperer
concert performances in Italy from the same timeframe. The LP I
transferred is labeled as part of LAR37; the Shostakovich 9 is Side 6;
other side of the LP is Side 5, Pulcinella Suite.  I may be able to
get the rest of the LP set.  If so, hopefully it will be in the same
fine condition as this LP.
As for RAI's digital archive of their broadcasts, wouldn't the
digitalization make them "new" recordings and thus subject to
copyright for decades into the future; while (at least in Europe) the
original analog recordings would now be public domain? Perhaps someday
they may become interested enough to make a CD or downloadable issue
of these and other fine concerts in their library. The sound on the
Fonit Cetra LP is definitely heavily filtered; there appears to be
nothing above 8KHz on the LP.
As far as I am aware, any digitization of an out-of-copyright recording,
does not infer new copyright entitlements of the performance as such.
But I could be wrong of course.
It will depend on the laws of the country, but generally speaking a new
digitization would create a new "publication" of the item, so you
couldn't take the new digitization and create and sell copies.  This
new release would not affect the copyright on the original recordings
themselves.
-Owen- Nascondi testo citato
- Mostra testo citato -
I had understood that a re-broadcast in which the material is
remastered makes a new copyright. When I expressed a wish that RAI's
digitalizations might be made available I meant in a proper and legal
manner. Arts Archive have issued a considerable series covering Maag,
Cluytens and Giulini using the original tapes so RAI will evidently
negotiate if approached. Any issue bearing the trademark
"RaiTrade" (this includes a number of opera videos too) is official.

Chris Howell
RiRiIII
2010-04-08 09:30:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by GP49
Post by TareeDawg
This concert took place on Dec 21st 1956 in Turin.
I have the whole concert on cassette. Also from the concert on my
cassette is Till Eulenspiegel, Pulcinella Suite (1949) and Haydn's
symphony 101 The Clock.
The first movement of the Shosty 9 is how I expect it to go. Wonderful
performance by Klemps at his considerable peak. The tape was copied from
a Fonit Cetra recording LAR37.
Fonit Cetra LAR37, I believe, is a three-LP set with several Klemperer
concert performances in Italy from the same timeframe. The LP I
transferred is labeled as part of LAR37; the Shostakovich 9 is Side 6;
other side of the LP is Side 5, Pulcinella Suite.  I may be able to
get the rest of the LP set.  If so, hopefully it will be in the same
fine condition as this LP.
As for RAI's digital archive of their broadcasts, wouldn't the
digitalization make them "new" recordings and thus subject to
copyright for decades into the future; while (at least in Europe) the
original analog recordings would now be public domain? Perhaps someday
they may become interested enough to make a CD or downloadable issue
of these and other fine concerts in their library. The sound on the
Fonit Cetra LP is definitely heavily filtered; there appears to be
nothing above 8KHz on the LP.
Italian Radio Tre broadcast the following on 5 & 6 October 2008:


ESERCIZI DI MEMORIA - SUONI DALL'ARCHIVIO DELLA RADIO
OTTO KLEMPERER

Ludwig van Beethoven
Sinfonia n.1 in do maggiore op.21

Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer


Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 17 dicembre 1956

------------------------------------------------------------

Igor Stravinskij
Pulcinella, suite dal balletto per piccola orchestra

Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer


Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 21 dicembre 1955

------------------------------------------------------------

Dimitri Sostakovic
Sinfonia n.9 in mi bemolle maggiore op.70

Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer


Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 21 dicembre 1955

------------------------------------------------------------

Franz Joseph Haydn
Sinfonia n.101 in re maggiore "La pendola"

Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer


Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 21 dicembre 1955
ESERCIZI DI MEMORIA - SUONI DALL'ARCHIVIO DELLA RADIO
OTTO KLEMPERER

Richard Wagner
Die Meistersinger von Nürnberg, ouverture

Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer


Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 17 dicembre 1956

------------------------------------------------------------

Richard Strauss
Till Eulenspiegels lustige Streiche, poema sinfonico op.28

Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer


Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 21 dicembre 1955

------------------------------------------------------------

Franz Schubert
Sinfonia n.8 in si minore D 759, "Incompiuta"

Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer


Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 17 dicembre 1956

------------------------------------------------------------

Ludwig van Beethoven
Sinfonia n.3 in mi bemolle maggiore op.55 "Eroica"

New Philharmonia Orchestra of London
Direttore, Otto Klemperer


Registrazione effettuata a Bonn il 25 settembre 1970
Christopher Howell
2010-04-08 10:16:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by RiRiIII
Post by GP49
Post by TareeDawg
This concert took place on Dec 21st 1956 in Turin.
I have the whole concert on cassette. Also from the concert on my
cassette is Till Eulenspiegel, Pulcinella Suite (1949) and Haydn's
symphony 101 The Clock.
The first movement of the Shosty 9 is how I expect it to go. Wonderful
performance by Klemps at his considerable peak. The tape was copied from
a Fonit Cetra recording LAR37.
Fonit Cetra LAR37, I believe, is a three-LP set with several Klemperer
concert performances in Italy from the same timeframe. The LP I
transferred is labeled as part of LAR37; the Shostakovich 9 is Side 6;
other side of the LP is Side 5, Pulcinella Suite.  I may be able to
get the rest of the LP set.  If so, hopefully it will be in the same
fine condition as this LP.
As for RAI's digital archive of their broadcasts, wouldn't the
digitalization make them "new" recordings and thus subject to
copyright for decades into the future; while (at least in Europe) the
original analog recordings would now be public domain? Perhaps someday
they may become interested enough to make a CD or downloadable issue
of these and other fine concerts in their library. The sound on the
Fonit Cetra LP is definitely heavily filtered; there appears to be
nothing above 8KHz on the LP.
ESERCIZI DI MEMORIA - SUONI DALL'ARCHIVIO DELLA RADIO
OTTO KLEMPERER
Ludwig van Beethoven
Sinfonia n.1 in do maggiore op.21
Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer
Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 17 dicembre 1956
------------------------------------------------------------
Igor Stravinskij
Pulcinella, suite dal balletto per piccola orchestra
Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer
Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 21 dicembre 1955
------------------------------------------------------------
Dimitri Sostakovic
Sinfonia n.9 in mi bemolle maggiore op.70
Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer
Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 21 dicembre 1955
------------------------------------------------------------
Franz Joseph Haydn
Sinfonia n.101 in re maggiore "La pendola"
Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer
Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 21 dicembre 1955
ESERCIZI DI MEMORIA - SUONI DALL'ARCHIVIO DELLA RADIO
OTTO KLEMPERER
Richard Wagner
Die Meistersinger von Nürnberg, ouverture
Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer
Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 17 dicembre 1956
------------------------------------------------------------
Richard Strauss
Till Eulenspiegels lustige Streiche, poema sinfonico op.28
Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer
Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 21 dicembre 1955
------------------------------------------------------------
Franz Schubert
Sinfonia n.8 in si minore D 759, "Incompiuta"
Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer
Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 17 dicembre 1956
------------------------------------------------------------
Ludwig van Beethoven
Sinfonia n.3 in mi bemolle maggiore op.55 "Eroica"
New Philharmonia Orchestra of London
Direttore, Otto Klemperer
Registrazione effettuata a Bonn il 25 settembre 1970- Nascondi testo citato
- Mostra testo citato -
RAI are obviously sticking to their guns over 21 December 1955 rather
than 1956. On the other hand, Peter Heyworth was a pretty diligent
researcher and was apparently sure they had it wrong (as has been said
in this thread).
Casting my mind back, when I taped some of this material from a RAI
broadcast in the 1990s, it was presented by a critic who reminisced
about having attended these concerts in Turin when he was a student.
As I recall he certainly gave the impression of a fairly intense
encounter with Klemperer, concentrated in a short period. This would
bear out the idea that the concerts were only 5 days apart. He also
recalled that the orchestra were rather puzzled at first by the
remote, tall, gaunt figure on the rostrum but warmed to him as the
concerts went on..
Chris Howell
GP49
2010-04-08 15:37:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Christopher Howell
Post by RiRiIII
Post by GP49
Post by TareeDawg
This concert took place on Dec 21st 1956 in Turin.
I have the whole concert on cassette. Also from the concert on my
cassette is Till Eulenspiegel, Pulcinella Suite (1949) and Haydn's
symphony 101 The Clock.
The first movement of the Shosty 9 is how I expect it to go. Wonderful
performance by Klemps at his considerable peak. The tape was copied from
a Fonit Cetra recording LAR37.
Fonit Cetra LAR37, I believe, is a three-LP set with several Klemperer
concert performances in Italy from the same timeframe. The LP I
transferred is labeled as part of LAR37; the Shostakovich 9 is Side 6;
other side of the LP is Side 5, Pulcinella Suite.  I may be able to
get the rest of the LP set.  If so, hopefully it will be in the same
fine condition as this LP.
As for RAI's digital archive of their broadcasts, wouldn't the
digitalization make them "new" recordings and thus subject to
copyright for decades into the future; while (at least in Europe) the
original analog recordings would now be public domain? Perhaps someday
they may become interested enough to make a CD or downloadable issue
of these and other fine concerts in their library. The sound on the
Fonit Cetra LP is definitely heavily filtered; there appears to be
nothing above 8KHz on the LP.
ESERCIZI DI MEMORIA - SUONI DALL'ARCHIVIO DELLA RADIO
OTTO KLEMPERER
Ludwig van Beethoven
Sinfonia n.1 in do maggiore op.21
Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer
Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 17 dicembre 1956
------------------------------------------------------------
Igor Stravinskij
Pulcinella, suite dal balletto per piccola orchestra
Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer
Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 21 dicembre 1955
------------------------------------------------------------
Dimitri Sostakovic
Sinfonia n.9 in mi bemolle maggiore op.70
Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer
Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 21 dicembre 1955
------------------------------------------------------------
Franz Joseph Haydn
Sinfonia n.101 in re maggiore "La pendola"
Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer
Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 21 dicembre 1955
ESERCIZI DI MEMORIA - SUONI DALL'ARCHIVIO DELLA RADIO
OTTO KLEMPERER
Richard Wagner
Die Meistersinger von Nürnberg, ouverture
Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer
Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 17 dicembre 1956
------------------------------------------------------------
Richard Strauss
Till Eulenspiegels lustige Streiche, poema sinfonico op.28
Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer
Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 21 dicembre 1955
------------------------------------------------------------
Franz Schubert
Sinfonia n.8 in si minore D 759, "Incompiuta"
Orchestra Sinfonica di Torino della Rai
Direttore, Otto Klemperer
Registrazione effettuata a Torino il 17 dicembre 1956
------------------------------------------------------------
Ludwig van Beethoven
Sinfonia n.3 in mi bemolle maggiore op.55 "Eroica"
New Philharmonia Orchestra of London
Direttore, Otto Klemperer
Registrazione effettuata a Bonn il 25 settembre 1970- Nascondi testo citato
- Mostra testo citato -
RAI are obviously sticking to their guns over 21 December 1955 rather
than 1956. On the other hand, Peter Heyworth was a pretty diligent
researcher and was apparently sure they had it wrong (as has been said
in this thread).
Casting my mind back, when I taped some of this material from a RAI
broadcast in the 1990s, it was presented by a critic who reminisced
about having attended these concerts in Turin when he was a student.
As I recall he certainly gave the impression of a fairly intense
encounter with Klemperer, concentrated in a short period. This would
bear out the idea that the concerts were only 5 days apart. He also
recalled that the orchestra were rather puzzled at first by the
remote, tall, gaunt figure on the rostrum but warmed to him as the
concerts went on..
=====================================

Elsewhere in Heyworth's discography, it is stated that on 17DEC1955,
Klemperer was recording Beethoven with the Philharmonia Orchestra at
Kingsway Hall in London, his famous mono Beethoven 3 and 5; and
Beethoven 7 in mono and experimental stereo. It was probably a make-
up session to fill ingaps in the takes that had been done in early
October. By no means does this make it impossible for Klemperer to
have gone to Turin for concerts there, five days later, but it seems
unlikely.
GP49
2010-04-06 14:07:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Christopher Howell
Re the correct date, what is your source for this? RAI themselves
announced it as 21 December 1955 (and the same date for Stravinsky
Pulcinella and Strauss Till Eulenspiegel) and they should know, though
I suppose if their own catalogue is mistaken this would account for
others having repeated the mistake over the years. From 17 December
1956 is a concert including Beethoven 1 and Schubert 8.I must say it
seems unlikely two different programmes were played only five days
apart since the Turin concerts were always held weekly and I'd tend to
believe RAI's own dating unless you have conclusive evidence that
it's wrong.
=============================

I referenced the discography in Volume II of Peter Heyworth's Otto
Klemperer biography. It specifically mentions the discrepancy in
concert date.
woytek
2010-04-06 14:50:18 UTC
Permalink
Big thanks for making available this rare recording. If You can upload
other two LP's from Fonit Cetra LAR37 - it will be great!
Neil
2010-04-06 15:14:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by GP49
Shostakovich: Symphony No. 9
RAI Symphony Orchestra
Otto Klemperer, conductor
Live broadcast concert
This is awesome!!! thanks.

I wish I could get hold of his Sibelius 4th. AFAIK only every
conducted in once...
GP49
2010-04-08 05:31:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Neil
I wish I could get hold of his Sibelius 4th. AFAIK only
conducted in once...
With the Los Angeles Philarmonic, IIRC. In those days, Sibelius 4 was
regarded as "new music" and Klemperer was constantly in a battle with
the LA Phil's management, for his programming too much modern music.
Remember that this was the orchestra whose management wanted the
Tchaikovsky Symphony No. 6 to be performed without the last movement,
so that it would end rousingly with the march-like third movement.

Although archival material has come out of Klemperer's Los Angeles
days, there isn't any Sibelius.
woytek
2010-04-06 19:33:04 UTC
Permalink
Fifties was tremendous time for RAI orchestras in Rome and Turin.
Concerts with Klemperer, Walter, Rodzinski (Szymanowski Stabat
Mater), Celibidache, Barbirolli (great Dream of Gerontius),
Furtwangler (Wagner Ring)... On European Archives are available Fonit
Cetra LP's with Furtwangler Concerts from Rome and Torino:
- http://www.europarchive.org/item.php?id=lp-31332_BeG Beethoven IV
Piano Concerto Pietro Scarpini Rome 19.01.1952
- http://www.europarchive.org/item.php?id=lp-31333_BeG Brahms Violin
Concerto Gioconda de Vito Turin 7.03.1952
- http://www.europarchive.org/item.php?id=lp-31334_BeG Beethoven
Eroica Rome 19.01.1952
- http://www.europarchive.org/item.php?id=lp-31335_BeG Beethoven V
Symphony Rome 19.01.1952
Sol L. Siegel
2010-04-07 05:04:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by GP49
Shostakovich: Symphony No. 9
RAI Symphony Orchestra
Otto Klemperer, conductor
Live broadcast concert
http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=
44dea677a83d2311111096d429abd3607274
Post by GP49
d1436d3c638882e3a934329c7a5e
OR, if you don't like how long links get displayed in abbreviated form
http://tinyurl.com/yaep4xy
From a mint-condition Fonit Cetra LP
Three FLACs, mono. Tracks are divided the same as on the source LP,
with Movements 3, 4 and 5 in one track.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Otto Klemperer is not exactly the first conductor one associates with
composer Dmitri Shostakovich...
...a great conductor is another thing and
Klemperer, even in music for which he presumably had only a passing
interest, was unmistakably that.
http://www.musicweb-
international.com/classrev/2002/July02/Shostakovich
Post by GP49
_Barshai.htm
Was the author of that article unaware of the oft-repeated story of
Klemperer visiting Shostakovich in Moscow in 1936, looking through the
score of the just-completed 4th Symphony and proclaiming it a
masterwork?

Somehow I can imagine Klemperer tackling the piece - assuming, of
course, that Shostakovich hadn't been forced to suppress it.
(Shostakovich reportedly was studying the score of Mahler's 7th, a work
that Klemperer eventually recorded, during the period just before
starting work on the 4th.) As it turned out, he never did. If he had,
it might not have fit on a single LP - or even CD!
--
- Sol L. Siegel, Philadelphia, PA USA
Christopher Howell
2010-04-07 06:01:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Sol L. Siegel
Was the author of that article unaware of the oft-repeated story of
Klemperer visiting Shostakovich in Moscow in 1936, looking through the
score of the just-completed 4th Symphony and proclaiming it a
masterwork?  
--
- Sol L. Siegel, Philadelphia, PA USA- Nascondi testo citato
Yes, the author of that article (myself as I've already said in this
thread) was unaware of that story and is grateful to have heard it
now.

Chris Howell
Christopher Howell
2010-04-07 06:08:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Sol L. Siegel
Somehow I can imagine Klemperer tackling the piece - assuming, of
course, that Shostakovich hadn't been forced to suppress it.  
(Shostakovich reportedly was studying the score of Mahler's 7th, a work
that Klemperer eventually recorded, during the period just before
starting work on the 4th.)  As it turned out, he never did.  If he had,
it might not have fit on a single LP - or even CD!
On the other contrary, if he'd recorded it around the time of his Vox
Bruckner 4 (1949), a 10" LP would have been enough. And as I pointed
out in my MusicWeb piece, even in the 1955 Shostakovich 9th, once past
the (deliciously) slow first movt, several of his tempi are faster
than Barshai

Chris Howell
GP49
2010-04-07 15:04:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by GP49
Post by GP49
Shostakovich: Symphony No. 9
RAI Symphony Orchestra
Otto Klemperer, conductor
Live broadcast concert
http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=
44dea677a83d2311111096d429abd3607274
Post by GP49
d1436d3c638882e3a934329c7a5e
OR, if you don't like how long links get displayed in abbreviated form
http://tinyurl.com/yaep4xy
From a mint-condition Fonit Cetra LP
Three FLACs, mono.  Tracks are divided the same as on the source LP,
with Movements 3, 4 and 5 in one track.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Otto Klemperer is not exactly the first conductor one associates with
composer Dmitri Shostakovich...
...a great conductor is another thing and
Klemperer, even in music for which he presumably had only a passing
interest, was unmistakably that.
http://www.musicweb-
international.com/classrev/2002/July02/Shostakovich
Post by GP49
_Barshai.htm
Was the author of that article unaware of the oft-repeated story of
Klemperer visiting Shostakovich in Moscow in 1936, looking through the
score of the just-completed 4th Symphony and proclaiming it a
masterwork?  
Somehow I can imagine Klemperer tackling the piece - assuming, of
course, that Shostakovich hadn't been forced to suppress it.  
(Shostakovich reportedly was studying the score of Mahler's 7th, a work
that Klemperer eventually recorded, during the period just before
starting work on the 4th.)  As it turned out, he never did.  If he had,
it might not have fit on a single LP - or even CD!
=============================

According to Heyworth, Klemperer visited Shostakovich on May 30, 1936.
At the piano, Shostakovich played his newly-completed (three days
earlier) Fourth Symphony and Klemperer was so impressed by its "strong
Mahlerian flavor" that he requested the right to the first performance
outside the USSR. Of course, that was not to be as the Fourth
Symphony was withdrawn by Shostakovich that winter, while under
intense official criticism of his recent music while Stalinist purges
were sweeping the country; the first Moscow Show Trials had taken
place in August 1936 and had resulted in death sentences for the
primary defendants.
gggg gggg
2021-12-29 07:42:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by GP49
Shostakovich: Symphony No. 9
RAI Symphony Orchestra
Otto Klemperer, conductor
Live broadcast concert
http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=44dea677a83d2311111096d429abd3607274d1436d3c638882e3a934329c7a5e
OR, if you don't like how long links get displayed in abbreviated form
http://tinyurl.com/yaep4xy
From a mint-condition Fonit Cetra LP
Three FLACs, mono. Tracks are divided the same as on the source LP,
with Movements 3, 4 and 5 in one track.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Otto Klemperer is not exactly the first conductor one associates with
composer Dmitri Shostakovich.
Klemperer never commercially recorded Shostakovich but a radio
broadcast
documents his live concert performance of the Shostakovich Symphony
No.
9 with the RAI Symphony Orchestra in Turin on 21 DEC 1956. This
recording has been issued intermittenly on various labels (which
misdate
it as "1955"); but it does not appear to be currently available.
Musicweb International, in its website, compares Klemperer's
...Barshai proved that a Russian could be perfectly idiomatic in
Mozart and Beethoven. After his move to the west in 1976 Barshai has
won a lot of respect without ever quite making it to the top. The
booklet profile (from a commercial issue of Barshai's Shostakovich
cycle), taking up a comment by Shostakovich about Barshai’s "Eroica",
states that his "music-making could most easily be compared to
Klemperer’s".
Easily said, when Klemperer recordings of Shostakovich are not
exactly two-a-penny. But wait, there is one, so let’s examine the two
conductors in Shostakovich’s 9th Symphony. Klemperer’s 1955 Turin
performance of this work used to be available on a Cetra LP and is
occasionally re-broadcast by the RAI; we may hope that one day a
re-mastering of the original tapes will produce a less scrawny sound
than that of the off-the-air tape I am working from. At the outset
Klemperer is so much slower than Barshai that it seems ridiculous,
but then you realise that he is thoroughly enjoying the droll humour
of it all, and he gets bouncier rhythms and cheekier phrasing. It
sounds closer to Kurt Weill’s pre-war Berlin than to post-war
Shostakovich, but it has character and I’m afraid Barshai’s neat
reading sounds merely bland in comparison. Klemperer also gets a
weird mixture of beauty and sleaze out of the second movement and in
the third movement, where he is scarcely slower than Barshai, the
players sound possessed where Barshai’s are no more than spick and
span. By this time Klemperer has the Turiners absolutely under his
thumb. The brass in the fourth movement blow raspberries in a way
Barshai does not even attempt and the Turin bassoonist is momentarily
transformed into the greatest bassoonist in the world as Klemperer
coaxes a saxophone-like whine and some bilious rubato from him. And
in the finale Klemperer, at a faster tempo than Barshai, again revels
in the cheekiness of the music.
don’t make comparisons that risk blowing up in your face! Barshai is
a very fine conductor but a great conductor is another thing and
Klemperer, even in music for which he presumably had only a passing
interest, was unmistakably that.
http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2002/July02/Shostakovich_Barshai.htm
(Recent Y. upload):

Repertoire: The BEST Shostakovich Ninth Symphony

Loading...