Discussion:
Another bronze medal
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number_six
2020-10-31 21:53:13 UTC
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So far bronzed discs in my collection are about one per thousand

Still it is vexing to encounter one

Latest is a used copy of Haydn Sym 22, 63,80 by Orpheus CO

It came up in my queue but was obviously compromised

I just ordered another used copy
Andrew Clarke
2020-11-01 00:39:50 UTC
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Post by number_six
So far bronzed discs in my collection are about one per thousand
Still it is vexing to encounter one
Latest is a used copy of Haydn Sym 22, 63,80 by Orpheus CO
It came up in my queue but was obviously compromised
I just ordered another used copy
When you get it, why not rip it? Then you've got an archival copy in case anything goes wrong with the disc.

Andrew Clarke
Canberra
Frank Berger
2020-11-01 05:30:47 UTC
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Post by Andrew Clarke
Post by number_six
So far bronzed discs in my collection are about one per thousand
Still it is vexing to encounter one
Latest is a used copy of Haydn Sym 22, 63,80 by Orpheus CO
It came up in my queue but was obviously compromised
I just ordered another used copy
When you get it, why not rip it? Then you've got an archival copy in case anything goes wrong with the disc.
Andrew Clarke
Canberra
According to DISCOGS, it looks like there were two
pressings, one in the UK and one in Germany. I would guess
if you he manages to get a German one a backup would be
unnecessary.
MiNe109
2020-11-01 14:32:08 UTC
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Post by number_six
So far bronzed discs in my collection are about one per thousand
Still it is vexing to encounter one
Latest is a used copy of Haydn Sym 22, 63,80 by Orpheus CO
It came up in my queue but was obviously compromised
I just ordered another used copy
When you get it, why not rip it?  Then you've got an archival copy in
case anything goes wrong with the disc.
Andrew Clarke
Canberra
According to DISCOGS, it looks like there were two pressings, one in the
UK and one in Germany.  I would guess if you he manages to get a German
one a backup would be unnecessary.
It's available as a download from Presto, too.
number_six
2020-11-01 16:46:49 UTC
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Post by Andrew Clarke
Post by number_six
So far bronzed discs in my collection are about one per thousand
Still it is vexing to encounter one
Latest is a used copy of Haydn Sym 22, 63,80 by Orpheus CO
It came up in my queue but was obviously compromised
I just ordered another used copy
When you get it, why not rip it? Then you've got an archival copy in case anything goes wrong with the disc.
Andrew Clarke
Canberra
Pretty soon I'll be in the market for a new computer and a cloud account!

That would help facilitate some selective ripping

Ripping everything is not in the cards...
weary flake
2020-11-01 21:26:09 UTC
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Post by Andrew Clarke
Post by number_six
So far bronzed discs in my collection are about one per thousand
Still it is vexing to encounter one
Latest is a used copy of Haydn Sym 22, 63,80 by Orpheus CO
It came up in my queue but was obviously compromised
I just ordered another used copy
When you get it, why not rip it? Then you've got an archival copy in
case anything goes wrong with the disc.
In my experience, CDs that started to bronze are more playable
on a CD player than on a computer drive. I've got a few that
the last tracks cannot be detected by computer but play on
a CD Player. I've made several back-ups where the resultant
rips were worse playing than the original CD in a player. My
guess is that optical drives spin too fast so are less able to
track a bronzing CD. I have not thought to try to play damaged
CDs in a DVD player so don't know about that.

Now it seems like the poster discovered it by listening to
to it already ripped. There's a chance that the CD plays
perfectly in a plain CD Player. Personally, I don't trust my
rips until I hear the complete result and I do not rip until
I've listened to my CDs first on a CD Player.
drh8h
2020-11-01 01:24:20 UTC
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Post by number_six
So far bronzed discs in my collection are about one per thousand
Still it is vexing to encounter one
Latest is a used copy of Haydn Sym 22, 63,80 by Orpheus CO
It came up in my queue but was obviously compromised
I just ordered another used copy
Was it a U.K. pressing? Most of the bronzing problems were with one manufacturer, PDO. I have a few they did for DG, but from a different period.

DH
number_six
2020-11-01 16:37:41 UTC
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Post by drh8h
Post by number_six
So far bronzed discs in my collection are about one per thousand
Still it is vexing to encounter one
Latest is a used copy of Haydn Sym 22, 63,80 by Orpheus CO
It came up in my queue but was obviously compromised
I just ordered another used copy
Was it a U.K. pressing? Most of the bronzing problems were with one manufacturer, PDO. I have a few they did for DG, but from a different period.
DH
Back insert says made in West Germany but yes, disk itself was made in the UK -- bit of a relief in a way as it does not add to the level of concern about other product
number_six
2020-11-06 20:35:15 UTC
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Replacement copy arrived from alternate seller

Disc was made in W Germany so I am in business
Frank Berger
2020-11-01 05:22:07 UTC
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Post by number_six
So far bronzed discs in my collection are about one per thousand
Still it is vexing to encounter one
Latest is a used copy of Haydn Sym 22, 63,80 by Orpheus CO
It came up in my queue but was obviously compromised
I just ordered another used copy
According to one list, there were only 4 DG releases pressed
at the PDO plant and subject to the bronzing problem and one
was your Haydn/Orpheus. I will have to find mine to check
the vintage and condition.
number_six
2020-11-01 16:39:51 UTC
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Post by Frank Berger
Post by number_six
So far bronzed discs in my collection are about one per thousand
Still it is vexing to encounter one
Latest is a used copy of Haydn Sym 22, 63,80 by Orpheus CO
It came up in my queue but was obviously compromised
I just ordered another used copy
According to one list, there were only 4 DG releases pressed
at the PDO plant and subject to the bronzing problem and one
was your Haydn/Orpheus. I will have to find mine to check
the vintage and condition.
Hope yours is in good shape.
Sol L. Siegel
2020-11-16 03:44:22 UTC
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Post by number_six
So far bronzed discs in my collection are about one per thousand
Still it is vexing to encounter one
Latest is a used copy of Haydn Sym 22, 63,80 by Orpheus CO
It came up in my queue but was obviously compromised
I just ordered another used copy
My bugaboo is the occasional CD where the last track mysteriously doesn't
play anymore on any of my computer drives, only on my Oppo. I've had them
on EMI, Sony, Harmonia Mundi and Decca, mostly from the 1990's but
sometimes later. So far I've usually been able to preserve them on my HD
by downloading the wounded track from Presto, but I expect the day will
come when that doesn't work.

- Sol L. Siegel, Philadelphia, PA USA
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number_six
2020-11-16 19:56:19 UTC
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Post by Sol L. Siegel
Post by number_six
So far bronzed discs in my collection are about one per thousand
Still it is vexing to encounter one
Latest is a used copy of Haydn Sym 22, 63,80 by Orpheus CO
It came up in my queue but was obviously compromised
I just ordered another used copy
My bugaboo is the occasional CD where the last track mysteriously doesn't
play anymore on any of my computer drives, only on my Oppo. I've had them
on EMI, Sony, Harmonia Mundi and Decca, mostly from the 1990's but
sometimes later. So far I've usually been able to preserve them on my HD
by downloading the wounded track from Presto, but I expect the day will
come when that doesn't work.
- Sol L. Siegel, Philadelphia, PA USA
--
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
Oddly, the issue runs in the opposite direction in my system.

The primary cd player (a Pioneer cartridge player given to me by a neighbor who was moving to assisted living) has deveoped an occasional hiccup -- but (so far) the tracks it cannot properly play have played fine on my computer drive.
Alan Dawes
2020-11-17 11:18:38 UTC
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Post by number_six
Oddly, the issue runs in the opposite direction in my system.
The primary cd player (a Pioneer cartridge player given to me by a
neighbor who was moving to assisted living) has deveoped an occasional
hiccup -- but (so far) the tracks it cannot properly play have played
fine on my computer drive.
I had the same thing happen on an old Technics CD player. The grease on
the "slide bars" along which the head moves had thickened with dust in
places. Wiping the old grease off with a soft tissue and applying a very
very small amount of thin grease sorted this out.

Alan
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***@argonet.co.uk
***@riscos.org
Using an ARMX6
number_six
2020-11-18 18:41:31 UTC
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In article <bdad1638-235e-446b.>,
Post by number_six
Oddly, the issue runs in the opposite direction in my system.
The primary cd player (a Pioneer cartridge player given to me by a
neighbor who was moving to assisted living) has deveoped an occasional
hiccup -- but (so far) the tracks it cannot properly play have played
fine on my computer drive.
I had the same thing happen on an old Technics CD player. The grease on
the "slide bars" along which the head moves had thickened with dust in
places. Wiping the old grease off with a soft tissue and applying a very
very small amount of thin grease sorted this out.
Alan
Good idea. Thanks!
Randy Lane
2020-11-18 23:32:19 UTC
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Post by Sol L. Siegel
Post by number_six
So far bronzed discs in my collection are about one per thousand
Still it is vexing to encounter one
Latest is a used copy of Haydn Sym 22, 63,80 by Orpheus CO
It came up in my queue but was obviously compromised
I just ordered another used copy
My bugaboo is the occasional CD where the last track mysteriously doesn't
play anymore on any of my computer drives, only on my Oppo. I've had them
on EMI, Sony, Harmonia Mundi and Decca, mostly from the 1990's but
sometimes later. So far I've usually been able to preserve them on my HD
by downloading the wounded track from Presto, but I expect the day will
come when that doesn't work.
- Sol L. Siegel, Philadelphia, PA USA
--
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
That often is associated with the computer CD/DVD player.
The cause is what is known as the offset. Different players, particularly from different manufacturers, have different offsets. I have several players from different manufacturers. So when that happens changing the CD player used often resolves the issue.

Ripper programs that run a configuration check when a player not previously used with the program is first used typically determine the offset then, storing the setting so errors like that can be prevented when that player is used. But even then there are still occasional misreads like the one you describe.
Sol L. Siegel
2020-11-19 21:35:59 UTC
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Post by Randy Lane
Post by Sol L. Siegel
My bugaboo is the occasional CD where the last track mysteriously
doesn't play anymore on any of my computer drives, only on my Oppo.
I've had them on EMI, Sony, Harmonia Mundi and Decca, mostly from
the 1990's but sometimes later. So far I've usually been able to
preserve them on my HD by downloading the wounded track from
Presto, but I expect the day will come when that doesn't work.
That often is associated with the computer CD/DVD player.
The cause is what is known as the offset. Different players,
particularly from different manufacturers, have different offsets. I
have several players from different manufacturers. So when that
happens changing the CD player used often resolves the issue.
Ripper programs that run a configuration check when a player not
previously used with the program is first used typically determine the
offset then, storing the setting so errors like that can be prevented
when that player is used. But even then there are still occasional
misreads like the one you describe.
Sounds right. But why do I have the problem on the same trakcs with
both the computer HD *and* the outboard disc drive I use to burn DVD-RWs?

- Sol L. Siegel, Philadelphia, PA USA
--
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
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