Discussion:
How I lost a girlfriend to Bruckner
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dk
2018-11-04 14:24:55 UTC
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I mentioned earlier Bruckner made me lose a
girlfriend during high school years. A great
explanation may be found here:



Enjoy!

dk
Herman
2018-11-04 14:40:40 UTC
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Post by dk
I mentioned earlier Bruckner made me lose a
girlfriend during high school years. A great
http://youtu.be/IuiQFwjcPVQ
Enjoy!
dk
your link seems to suggest she preferred the Fugue Explainer for his witty conversation and his provider potential?
dk
2018-11-05 14:50:27 UTC
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Post by Herman
Post by dk
I mentioned earlier Bruckner made me lose a
girlfriend during high school years. A great
http://youtu.be/IuiQFwjcPVQ
your link seems to suggest she preferred the
Fugue Explainer for his witty conversation
and his provider potential?
No, she hated the length and complexity of the
works! The video is a perfect illustration of
the pointlessness of counterpoint! ;-)

I was unceremoniously dumped with a remark
"think how many hours of skating we lost
because of your silly symphonies!" (we
had actually listened to a cycle of
the symphonies 3-9).

dk
Frank Berger
2018-11-05 19:29:38 UTC
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Post by dk
Post by Herman
Post by dk
I mentioned earlier Bruckner made me lose a
girlfriend during high school years. A great
http://youtu.be/IuiQFwjcPVQ
your link seems to suggest she preferred the
Fugue Explainer for his witty conversation
and his provider potential?
No, she hated the length and complexity of the
works! The video is a perfect illustration of
the pointlessness of counterpoint! ;-)
I was unceremoniously dumped with a remark
"think how many hours of skating we lost
because of your silly symphonies!" (we
had actually listened to a cycle of
the symphonies 3-9).
dk
I was introduced (in the sense of first hearing of him) in college by a
dorm mate who told me he had an orgasm listening to Bruckner. I imagine
that could cost you a girlfriend also. Not to mention embarrassing.
dk
2018-11-06 12:41:24 UTC
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Post by Frank Berger
Post by dk
Post by Herman
Post by dk
I mentioned earlier Bruckner made me lose a
girlfriend during high school years. A great
http://youtu.be/IuiQFwjcPVQ
your link seems to suggest she preferred the
Fugue Explainer for his witty conversation
and his provider potential?
No, she hated the length and complexity of the
works! The video is a perfect illustration of
the pointlessness of counterpoint! ;-)
I was unceremoniously dumped with a remark
"think how many hours of skating we lost
because of your silly symphonies!" (we
had actually listened to a cycle of
the symphonies 3-9).
I was introduced (in the sense of first hearing
of him) in college by a dorm mate who told me he
had an orgasm listening to Bruckner. I imagine
that could cost you a girlfriend also. Not to
mention embarrassing.
I cannot possibly imagine anyone having orgasms
while listening to Bruckner. It is the dourest
and most boring music ever composed. And think
of all the CO2 produced by the brass! ;-)

I only listen to Bruckner when I want to fall
asleep. The 8th conducted by Celibidache is a
more reliable sleeping medicine than anything
I have tried.

dk
JohnA
2018-11-06 13:54:46 UTC
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Post by dk
I cannot possibly imagine anyone having orgasms
while listening to Bruckner. It is the dourest
and most boring music ever composed. And think
of all the CO2 produced by the brass! ;-)
From
https://www.abruckner.com/editorsnote/features/interestingbernste/

Interesting anecdotes about Bernstein and Bruckner

From: "The Label, The Story of Columbia Records," by Gary Marmorstein. (Thunder Mouth Press, 2007; pp. 406-407):

"Peter Munves was always investigating why conductors favored one composer over another. So one evening he went backstage at Philharmonic Hall to find Bernstein sitting in his dressing room holding a glass of scotch and a cigarette - his usual post-concert pleasures - and he brought up the age-old issue of Mahler and Bruckner.

'The difference between Mahler and Bruckner,' Munves said, 'was that Mahler all his life was searching for God, and Bruckner had found God.'

'Bullshit,' said Bernstein

'What do you mean bullshit?'

'Look, there are no real orgasms in Bruckner's music,' Bernstein said. 'He doesn't reach a climax. He's always gonna be, but it never happens. He takes so long to make his points. He's very loquacious. No matter what you say about Mahler, he made his points'."

From a letter to Aaron Copland:

"Impossibly boring without personality, awkward & dull, masked in solemnity."

A personal experience from Henry Fogel:

"Bernstein only performed two Bruckner symphonies in his career - the Sixth and the Ninth, although he performed the Ninth frequently, and recorded it twice (once with New York and once, later, with Vienna Philharmonic). He did not care for the other Bruckner symphonies. I had the privilege of working with Bernstein over a period of about ten years, and touring with him and the New York Philharmonic in Japan in 1979. One night after a concert, and after he had signed autographs, I asked him why he didn't do other Bruckner besides the Ninth - particularly the Eighth, which I thought would be magnificent in his hands. He made a face and told me that it was a terrible piece -- too long, too many "false climaxes", etc. I argued with him, and he proceeded to drag me over to a piano (this was about 11:00 PM or so), and play through the entire symphony (though he didn't take the Scherzo repeat), commenting along the way on what he found wrong with it. What I find most remarkable about this, if you think about it, is that he didn't like this piece, never conducted it, yet knew it well enough to pull it out of his head and play through all of it at the piano, not having been prepared to do so at all! He was one of a kind."
Frank Berger
2018-11-06 14:34:03 UTC
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Post by JohnA
Post by dk
I cannot possibly imagine anyone having orgasms
while listening to Bruckner. It is the dourest
and most boring music ever composed. And think
of all the CO2 produced by the brass! ;-)
From
https://www.abruckner.com/editorsnote/features/interestingbernste/
Interesting anecdotes about Bernstein and Bruckner
"Peter Munves was always investigating why conductors favored one composer over another. So one evening he went backstage at Philharmonic Hall to find Bernstein sitting in his dressing room holding a glass of scotch and a cigarette - his usual post-concert pleasures - and he brought up the age-old issue of Mahler and Bruckner.
'The difference between Mahler and Bruckner,' Munves said, 'was that Mahler all his life was searching for God, and Bruckner had found God.'
'Bullshit,' said Bernstein
'What do you mean bullshit?'
'Look, there are no real orgasms in Bruckner's music,' Bernstein said. 'He doesn't reach a climax. He's always gonna be, but it never happens. He takes so long to make his points. He's very loquacious. No matter what you say about Mahler, he made his points'."
Surely this must be simply a matter of taste. I've never found myself
bored or impatient with Bruckner. It's the ride that matters, not the
only the climax. I can fall asleep to anything, but I don't find this a
problem with Bruckner more than any other composer. In 1978, I fell
asleep in the theater during a (then) spectacular spaceship battle scene.

In fact, there are multiple mini-climaxes in Bruckner, aren't there? I
suppose that could be considered a little deviant, but it takes all
kinds. Wait, am I still talking about music?
dk
2018-11-06 14:37:52 UTC
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Post by Frank Berger
Surely this must be simply a matter of taste.
Indeed.
Post by Frank Berger
I've never found myself bored or impatient with Bruckner.
I find myself impatient with most things and people! ;-)
Post by Frank Berger
In fact, there are multiple mini-climaxes in Bruckner,
aren't there? I suppose that could be considered a
little deviant, but it takes all kinds. Wait, am I
still talking about music?
As my friend Clara likes to say, "talking about music
is like dancing about architecture".

dk
dk
2018-11-06 14:34:32 UTC
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Post by JohnA
"Bernstein only performed two Bruckner symphonies in
his career - the Sixth and the Ninth, although he
performed the Ninth frequently, and recorded it
twice (once with New York and once, later, with
Vienna Philharmonic). He did not care for the
other Bruckner symphonies.
The 9th does indeed feel different from the others.
More drive and urgency, and not as shy about making
points. It was the first Bruckner symphony I heard,
and I must admit I overdosed on it during several
months. That was Furtwaengler's war time (1944?)
recording with the BPO. Just listening to it
again right now!

dk
Bob Harper
2018-11-07 01:18:09 UTC
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Post by dk
Post by JohnA
"Bernstein only performed two Bruckner symphonies in
his career - the Sixth and the Ninth, although he
performed the Ninth frequently, and recorded it
twice (once with New York and once, later, with
Vienna Philharmonic). He did not care for the
other Bruckner symphonies.
The 9th does indeed feel different from the others.
More drive and urgency, and not as shy about making
points. It was the first Bruckner symphony I heard,
and I must admit I overdosed on it during several
months. That was Furtwaengler's war time (1944?)
recording with the BPO. Just listening to it
again right now!
dk
That performance is sui generis. Were it in good stereo no one would
ever have to listen to another version (I know, I know, but at the time
it would certainly seem so!)

Bob Harper
dk
2018-11-07 02:06:58 UTC
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Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by JohnA
"Bernstein only performed two Bruckner symphonies in
his career - the Sixth and the Ninth, although he
performed the Ninth frequently, and recorded it
twice (once with New York and once, later, with
Vienna Philharmonic). He did not care for the
other Bruckner symphonies.
The 9th does indeed feel different from the others.
More drive and urgency, and not as shy about making
points. It was the first Bruckner symphony I heard,
and I must admit I overdosed on it during several
months. That was Furtwaengler's war time (1944?)
recording with the BPO. Just listening to it
again right now!
That performance is sui generis. Were it in good
stereo no one would ever have to listen to another
version (I know, I know, but at the time it would
certainly seem so!)
Also one of the fastest on record at under an hour!
Quite possibly one reason why I find it so riveting!
Listening right now.

dk
Bob Harper
2018-11-07 03:13:37 UTC
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Post by dk
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by JohnA
"Bernstein only performed two Bruckner symphonies in
his career - the Sixth and the Ninth, although he
performed the Ninth frequently, and recorded it
twice (once with New York and once, later, with
Vienna Philharmonic). He did not care for the
other Bruckner symphonies.
The 9th does indeed feel different from the others.
More drive and urgency, and not as shy about making
points. It was the first Bruckner symphony I heard,
and I must admit I overdosed on it during several
months. That was Furtwaengler's war time (1944?)
recording with the BPO. Just listening to it
again right now!
That performance is sui generis. Were it in good
stereo no one would ever have to listen to another
version (I know, I know, but at the time it would
certainly seem so!)
Also one of the fastest on record at under an hour!
Quite possibly one reason why I find it so riveting!
Listening right now.
dk
Yes, it IS swift. Another that, while not nearly as manic, is quite
swift and expressionistic is Gunter Wand's first recording on
Vox--apparently OP right now. Worth finding.

Bob Harper
Frank Berger
2018-11-07 13:18:53 UTC
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Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by JohnA
"Bernstein only performed two Bruckner symphonies in
his career - the Sixth and the Ninth, although he
performed the Ninth frequently, and recorded it
twice (once with New York and once, later, with
Vienna Philharmonic). He did not care for the
other Bruckner symphonies.
The 9th does indeed feel different from the others.
More drive and urgency, and not as shy about making
points. It was the first Bruckner symphony I heard,
and I must admit I overdosed on it during several
months. That was Furtwaengler's war time (1944?)
recording with the BPO. Just listening to it
again right now!
That performance is sui generis. Were it in good
stereo no one would ever have to listen to another
version (I know, I know, but at the time it would
certainly seem so!)
Also one of the fastest on record at under an hour!
Quite possibly one reason why I find it so riveting!
Listening right now.
dk
Yes, it IS swift. Another that, while not nearly as manic, is quite
swift and expressionistic is Gunter Wand's first recording on
Vox--apparently OP right now. Worth finding.
Bob Harper
There is a 58 minute 9th by Wand from 1979 released on the Profil label.
This seems to be quite a bit swifter than Wand's other recordings. Is
this the one you mean? An Amazon reviewer raved about it FWIW.
Recorded live but with little or no audience noise. I couldn't find
reference to a Vox recording.
Frank Berger
2018-11-07 16:32:48 UTC
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Post by Frank Berger
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by JohnA
"Bernstein only performed two Bruckner symphonies in
his career - the Sixth and the Ninth, although he
performed the Ninth frequently, and recorded it
twice (once with New York and once, later, with
Vienna Philharmonic). He did not care for the
other Bruckner symphonies.
The 9th does indeed feel different from the others.
More drive and urgency, and not as shy about making
points. It was the first Bruckner symphony I heard,
and I must admit I overdosed on it during several
months. That was Furtwaengler's war time (1944?)
recording with the BPO. Just listening to it
again right now!
That performance is sui generis. Were it in good
stereo no one would ever have to listen to another
version (I know, I know, but at the time it would
certainly seem so!)
Also one of the fastest on record at under an hour!
Quite possibly one reason why I find it so riveting!
Listening right now.
dk
Yes, it IS swift. Another that, while not nearly as manic, is quite
swift and expressionistic is Gunter Wand's first recording on
Vox--apparently OP right now. Worth finding.
Bob Harper
There is a 58 minute 9th by Wand from 1979 released on the Profil label.
This seems to be quite a bit swifter than Wand's other recordings.  Is
this the one you mean?  An Amazon reviewer raved about it FWIW. Recorded
live but with little or no audience noise.   I couldn't find reference
to a Vox recording.
P.S. You weren't thinking of Horenstein, were you?
dk
2018-11-07 17:20:13 UTC
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Post by Frank Berger
Post by Frank Berger
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by JohnA
"Bernstein only performed two Bruckner symphonies in
his career - the Sixth and the Ninth, although he
performed the Ninth frequently, and recorded it
twice (once with New York and once, later, with
Vienna Philharmonic). He did not care for the
other Bruckner symphonies.
The 9th does indeed feel different from the others.
More drive and urgency, and not as shy about making
points. It was the first Bruckner symphony I heard,
and I must admit I overdosed on it during several
months. That was Furtwaengler's war time (1944?)
recording with the BPO. Just listening to it
again right now!
That performance is sui generis. Were it in good
stereo no one would ever have to listen to another
version (I know, I know, but at the time it would
certainly seem so!)
Also one of the fastest on record at under an hour!
Quite possibly one reason why I find it so riveting!
Listening right now.
Yes, it IS swift. Another that, while not nearly as manic, is quite
swift and expressionistic is Gunter Wand's first recording on
Vox--apparently OP right now. Worth finding.
There is a 58 minute 9th by Wand from 1979 released on the Profil label.
This seems to be quite a bit swifter than Wand's other recordings.  Is
this the one you mean?  An Amazon reviewer raved about it FWIW. Recorded
live but with little or no audience noise.   I couldn't find reference
to a Vox recording.
P.S. You weren't thinking of Horenstein, were you?
Besides Furty, "fast" Bruckner 9th performances
under an hour include Karajan, Kna, Barbirolli,
Schuricht, Keilberth, and even one earlier
Jochum performance.

Note however that comparisons of duration are
difficult to make since different editions are
used.

dk
Gerard
2018-11-07 17:57:25 UTC
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Post by dk
Post by Frank Berger
Post by Frank Berger
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by JohnA
"Bernstein only performed two Bruckner symphonies in
his career - the Sixth and the Ninth, although he
performed the Ninth frequently, and recorded it
twice (once with New York and once, later, with
Vienna Philharmonic). He did not care for the
other Bruckner symphonies.
The 9th does indeed feel different from the others.
More drive and urgency, and not as shy about making
points. It was the first Bruckner symphony I heard,
and I must admit I overdosed on it during several
months. That was Furtwaengler's war time (1944?)
recording with the BPO. Just listening to it
again right now!
That performance is sui generis. Were it in good
stereo no one would ever have to listen to another
version (I know, I know, but at the time it would
certainly seem so!)
Also one of the fastest on record at under an hour!
Quite possibly one reason why I find it so riveting!
Listening right now.
Yes, it IS swift. Another that, while not nearly as manic, is quite
swift and expressionistic is Gunter Wand's first recording on
Vox--apparently OP right now. Worth finding.
There is a 58 minute 9th by Wand from 1979 released on the Profil label.
This seems to be quite a bit swifter than Wand's other recordings.  Is
this the one you mean?  An Amazon reviewer raved about it FWIW. Recorded
live but with little or no audience noise.   I couldn't find reference
to a Vox recording.
P.S. You weren't thinking of Horenstein, were you?
Besides Furty, "fast" Bruckner 9th performances
under an hour include Karajan, Kna, Barbirolli,
Schuricht, Keilberth, and even one earlier
Jochum performance.
Note however that comparisons of duration are
difficult to make since different editions are
used.
dk
https://www.abruckner.com/discography/symphonyno9indmino2/
m***@gmail.com
2018-11-07 18:44:54 UTC
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Post by Frank Berger
Post by Frank Berger
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by JohnA
"Bernstein only performed two Bruckner symphonies in
his career - the Sixth and the Ninth, although he
performed the Ninth frequently, and recorded it
twice (once with New York and once, later, with
Vienna Philharmonic). He did not care for the
other Bruckner symphonies.
The 9th does indeed feel different from the others.
More drive and urgency, and not as shy about making
points. It was the first Bruckner symphony I heard,
and I must admit I overdosed on it during several
months. That was Furtwaengler's war time (1944?)
recording with the BPO. Just listening to it
again right now!
That performance is sui generis. Were it in good
stereo no one would ever have to listen to another
version (I know, I know, but at the time it would
certainly seem so!)
Also one of the fastest on record at under an hour!
Quite possibly one reason why I find it so riveting!
Listening right now.
dk
Yes, it IS swift. Another that, while not nearly as manic, is quite
swift and expressionistic is Gunter Wand's first recording on
Vox--apparently OP right now. Worth finding.
Bob Harper
There is a 58 minute 9th by Wand from 1979 released on the Profil label.
This seems to be quite a bit swifter than Wand's other recordings.  Is
this the one you mean?  An Amazon reviewer raved about it FWIW. Recorded
live but with little or no audience noise.   I couldn't find reference
to a Vox recording.
P.S. You weren't thinking of Horenstein, were you?
I checked an old Schwann catalog and it does show a Horenstein on Vox with the Vienna pro Musica.
Frank Berger
2018-11-07 18:54:27 UTC
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Post by m***@gmail.com
Post by Frank Berger
Post by Frank Berger
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by JohnA
"Bernstein only performed two Bruckner symphonies in
his career - the Sixth and the Ninth, although he
performed the Ninth frequently, and recorded it
twice (once with New York and once, later, with
Vienna Philharmonic). He did not care for the
other Bruckner symphonies.
The 9th does indeed feel different from the others.
More drive and urgency, and not as shy about making
points. It was the first Bruckner symphony I heard,
and I must admit I overdosed on it during several
months. That was Furtwaengler's war time (1944?)
recording with the BPO. Just listening to it
again right now!
That performance is sui generis. Were it in good
stereo no one would ever have to listen to another
version (I know, I know, but at the time it would
certainly seem so!)
Also one of the fastest on record at under an hour!
Quite possibly one reason why I find it so riveting!
Listening right now.
dk
Yes, it IS swift. Another that, while not nearly as manic, is quite
swift and expressionistic is Gunter Wand's first recording on
Vox--apparently OP right now. Worth finding.
Bob Harper
There is a 58 minute 9th by Wand from 1979 released on the Profil label.
This seems to be quite a bit swifter than Wand's other recordings.  Is
this the one you mean?  An Amazon reviewer raved about it FWIW. Recorded
live but with little or no audience noise.   I couldn't find reference
to a Vox recording.
P.S. You weren't thinking of Horenstein, were you?
I checked an old Schwann catalog and it does show a Horenstein on Vox with the Vienna pro Musica.
I knew that one existed. I have it. I was asking Bob if he mistakenly
meant that one since I couldn't find any recording by Wand on Vox.
m***@gmail.com
2018-11-07 22:22:31 UTC
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Post by Frank Berger
Post by m***@gmail.com
Post by Frank Berger
Post by Frank Berger
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by JohnA
"Bernstein only performed two Bruckner symphonies in
his career - the Sixth and the Ninth, although he
performed the Ninth frequently, and recorded it
twice (once with New York and once, later, with
Vienna Philharmonic). He did not care for the
other Bruckner symphonies.
The 9th does indeed feel different from the others.
More drive and urgency, and not as shy about making
points. It was the first Bruckner symphony I heard,
and I must admit I overdosed on it during several
months. That was Furtwaengler's war time (1944?)
recording with the BPO. Just listening to it
again right now!
That performance is sui generis. Were it in good
stereo no one would ever have to listen to another
version (I know, I know, but at the time it would
certainly seem so!)
Also one of the fastest on record at under an hour!
Quite possibly one reason why I find it so riveting!
Listening right now.
dk
Yes, it IS swift. Another that, while not nearly as manic, is quite
swift and expressionistic is Gunter Wand's first recording on
Vox--apparently OP right now. Worth finding.
Bob Harper
There is a 58 minute 9th by Wand from 1979 released on the Profil label.
This seems to be quite a bit swifter than Wand's other recordings.  Is
this the one you mean?  An Amazon reviewer raved about it FWIW. Recorded
live but with little or no audience noise.   I couldn't find reference
to a Vox recording.
P.S. You weren't thinking of Horenstein, were you?
I checked an old Schwann catalog and it does show a Horenstein on Vox with the Vienna pro Musica.
I knew that one existed. I have it. I was asking Bob if he mistakenly
meant that one since I couldn't find any recording by Wand on Vox.
Right it was fun going through the old Schwann. There were a number of Horenstein Bruckner issues on Vox. Technical question - I installed Thunderbird and I'm setting it up and it asks me for the news server. I'm not too good at technical stuff - would that be google.groups.com??? or something else?? sorry for being dense. meyer
Steven Bornfeld
2018-11-07 22:51:01 UTC
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Post by m***@gmail.com
Right it was fun going through the old Schwann. There were a number of Horenstein Bruckner issues on Vox. Technical question - I installed Thunderbird and I'm setting it up and it asks me for the news server. I'm not too good at technical stuff - would that be google.groups.com??? or something else?? sorry for being dense. meyer
No. Your ISP either has or doesn't have an news nntp server. I haven't
had one in years, so I use one of the remaining free servers--news.aioe.org.

Steve
Frank Berger
2018-11-07 22:55:28 UTC
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Post by m***@gmail.com
Post by Frank Berger
Post by m***@gmail.com
Post by Frank Berger
Post by Frank Berger
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by JohnA
"Bernstein only performed two Bruckner symphonies in
his career - the Sixth and the Ninth, although he
performed the Ninth frequently, and recorded it
twice (once with New York and once, later, with
Vienna Philharmonic). He did not care for the
other Bruckner symphonies.
The 9th does indeed feel different from the others.
More drive and urgency, and not as shy about making
points. It was the first Bruckner symphony I heard,
and I must admit I overdosed on it during several
months. That was Furtwaengler's war time (1944?)
recording with the BPO. Just listening to it
again right now!
That performance is sui generis. Were it in good
stereo no one would ever have to listen to another
version (I know, I know, but at the time it would
certainly seem so!)
Also one of the fastest on record at under an hour!
Quite possibly one reason why I find it so riveting!
Listening right now.
dk
Yes, it IS swift. Another that, while not nearly as manic, is quite
swift and expressionistic is Gunter Wand's first recording on
Vox--apparently OP right now. Worth finding.
Bob Harper
There is a 58 minute 9th by Wand from 1979 released on the Profil label.
This seems to be quite a bit swifter than Wand's other recordings.  Is
this the one you mean?  An Amazon reviewer raved about it FWIW. Recorded
live but with little or no audience noise.   I couldn't find reference
to a Vox recording.
P.S. You weren't thinking of Horenstein, were you?
I checked an old Schwann catalog and it does show a Horenstein on Vox with the Vienna pro Musica.
I knew that one existed. I have it. I was asking Bob if he mistakenly
meant that one since I couldn't find any recording by Wand on Vox.
Right it was fun going through the old Schwann. There were a number of Horenstein Bruckner issues on Vox. Technical question - I installed Thunderbird and I'm setting it up and it asks me for the news server. I'm not too good at technical stuff - would that be google.groups.com??? or something else?? sorry for being dense. meyer
Oops. Forgot about that. I pay about $5.00 per month to supernews for
the news feed. Very reliable. I don't know about free news feeds.
Used to come automatically with internet service. I don't think it does
anymore. Maybe it does with your internet feed. Sorry this is a bit
more complicated than I indicated.
Frank Berger
2018-11-07 22:57:43 UTC
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Post by Frank Berger
Post by Frank Berger
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by JohnA
"Bernstein only performed two Bruckner symphonies in
his career - the Sixth and the Ninth, although he
performed the Ninth frequently, and recorded it
twice (once with New York and once, later, with
Vienna Philharmonic). He did not care for the
other Bruckner symphonies.
The 9th does indeed feel different from the others.
More drive and urgency, and not as shy about making
points. It was the first Bruckner symphony I heard,
and I must admit I overdosed on it during several
months. That was Furtwaengler's war time (1944?)
recording with the BPO. Just listening to it
again right now!
That performance is sui generis. Were it in good
stereo no one would ever have to listen to another
version (I know, I know, but at the time it would
certainly seem so!)
Also one of the fastest on record at under an hour!
Quite possibly one reason why I find it so riveting!
Listening right now.
dk
Yes, it IS swift. Another that, while not nearly as manic, is quite
swift and expressionistic is Gunter Wand's first recording on
Vox--apparently OP right now. Worth finding.
Bob Harper
There is a 58 minute 9th by Wand from 1979 released on the Profil label.
This seems to be quite a bit swifter than Wand's other recordings.  Is
this the one you mean?  An Amazon reviewer raved about it FWIW. Recorded
live but with little or no audience noise.   I couldn't find reference
to a Vox recording.
P.S. You weren't thinking of Horenstein, were you?
I checked an old Schwann catalog and it does show a Horenstein on Vox with the Vienna pro Musica.
I knew that one existed. I have it. I was asking Bob if he mistakenly
meant that one since I couldn't find any recording by Wand on Vox.
Right it was fun going through the old Schwann. There were a number of Horenstein Bruckner issues on Vox. Technical question - I installed Thunderbird and I'm setting it up and it asks me for the news server. I'm not too good at technical stuff - would that be google.groups.com??? or something else?? sorry for being dense. meyer
Looks like supernews is $11.99/month for new users. There is a free
trial advertised.
Steven Bornfeld
2018-11-07 23:51:20 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Frank Berger
Looks like supernews is $11.99/month for new users. There is a free
trial advertised.
The major downside of aioe.org is that the posts seem to disappear in a
couple of months. I rarely access news server from home (I just waste
time here in the office), but I don't remember that server deleting
posts. I'll check when I get a chance. I may actually have a news
server at home.

Steve
m***@gmail.com
2018-11-08 00:20:59 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Frank Berger
Post by m***@gmail.com
Post by Frank Berger
Post by m***@gmail.com
Post by Frank Berger
Post by Frank Berger
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by JohnA
"Bernstein only performed two Bruckner symphonies in
his career - the Sixth and the Ninth, although he
performed the Ninth frequently, and recorded it
twice (once with New York and once, later, with
Vienna Philharmonic). He did not care for the
other Bruckner symphonies.
The 9th does indeed feel different from the others.
More drive and urgency, and not as shy about making
points. It was the first Bruckner symphony I heard,
and I must admit I overdosed on it during several
months. That was Furtwaengler's war time (1944?)
recording with the BPO. Just listening to it
again right now!
That performance is sui generis. Were it in good
stereo no one would ever have to listen to another
version (I know, I know, but at the time it would
certainly seem so!)
Also one of the fastest on record at under an hour!
Quite possibly one reason why I find it so riveting!
Listening right now.
dk
Yes, it IS swift. Another that, while not nearly as manic, is quite
swift and expressionistic is Gunter Wand's first recording on
Vox--apparently OP right now. Worth finding.
Bob Harper
There is a 58 minute 9th by Wand from 1979 released on the Profil label.
This seems to be quite a bit swifter than Wand's other recordings.  Is
this the one you mean?  An Amazon reviewer raved about it FWIW. Recorded
live but with little or no audience noise.   I couldn't find reference
to a Vox recording.
P.S. You weren't thinking of Horenstein, were you?
I checked an old Schwann catalog and it does show a Horenstein on Vox with the Vienna pro Musica.
I knew that one existed. I have it. I was asking Bob if he mistakenly
meant that one since I couldn't find any recording by Wand on Vox.
Right it was fun going through the old Schwann. There were a number of Horenstein Bruckner issues on Vox. Technical question - I installed Thunderbird and I'm setting it up and it asks me for the news server. I'm not too good at technical stuff - would that be google.groups.com??? or something else?? sorry for being dense. meyer
Looks like supernews is $11.99/month for new users. There is a free
trial advertised.
oh OK thanks
Bob Harper
2018-11-09 02:11:29 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Frank Berger
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by JohnA
"Bernstein only performed two Bruckner symphonies in
his career - the Sixth and the Ninth, although he
performed the Ninth frequently, and recorded it
twice (once with New York and once, later, with
Vienna Philharmonic). He did not care for the
other Bruckner symphonies.
The 9th does indeed feel different from the others.
More drive and urgency, and not as shy about making
points. It was the first Bruckner symphony I heard,
and I must admit I overdosed on it during several
months. That was Furtwaengler's war time (1944?)
recording with the BPO. Just listening to it
again right now!
That performance is sui generis. Were it in good
stereo no one would ever have to listen to another
version (I know, I know, but at the time it would
certainly seem so!)
Also one of the fastest on record at under an hour!
Quite possibly one reason why I find it so riveting!
Listening right now.
dk
Yes, it IS swift. Another that, while not nearly as manic, is quite
swift and expressionistic is Gunter Wand's first recording on
Vox--apparently OP right now. Worth finding.
Bob Harper
There is a 58 minute 9th by Wand from 1979 released on the Profil
label. This seems to be quite a bit swifter than Wand's other
recordings.  Is this the one you mean?  An Amazon reviewer raved about
it FWIW. Recorded live but with little or no audience noise.   I
couldn't find reference to a Vox recording.
P.S.  You weren't thinking of Horenstein, were you?
In fact I was. Brain cramp, besides which I didn't get up to look on my
shelves.

Bob Harper
Frank Berger
2018-11-09 02:35:24 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Bob Harper
Post by Frank Berger
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by Bob Harper
Post by dk
Post by JohnA
"Bernstein only performed two Bruckner symphonies in
his career - the Sixth and the Ninth, although he
performed the Ninth frequently, and recorded it
twice (once with New York and once, later, with
Vienna Philharmonic). He did not care for the
other Bruckner symphonies.
The 9th does indeed feel different from the others.
More drive and urgency, and not as shy about making
points. It was the first Bruckner symphony I heard,
and I must admit I overdosed on it during several
months. That was Furtwaengler's war time (1944?)
recording with the BPO. Just listening to it
again right now!
That performance is sui generis. Were it in good
stereo no one would ever have to listen to another
version (I know, I know, but at the time it would
certainly seem so!)
Also one of the fastest on record at under an hour!
Quite possibly one reason why I find it so riveting!
Listening right now.
dk
Yes, it IS swift. Another that, while not nearly as manic, is quite
swift and expressionistic is Gunter Wand's first recording on
Vox--apparently OP right now. Worth finding.
Bob Harper
There is a 58 minute 9th by Wand from 1979 released on the Profil
label. This seems to be quite a bit swifter than Wand's other
recordings.  Is this the one you mean?  An Amazon reviewer raved
about it FWIW. Recorded live but with little or no audience noise.
I couldn't find reference to a Vox recording.
P.S.  You weren't thinking of Horenstein, were you?
In fact I was. Brain cramp, besides which I didn't get up to look on my
shelves.
Bob Harper
You don't know how long I looked for a Wand 9th on Vox.:-)

Frank Berger
2018-11-06 14:23:42 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by dk
Post by Frank Berger
Post by dk
Post by Herman
Post by dk
I mentioned earlier Bruckner made me lose a
girlfriend during high school years. A great
http://youtu.be/IuiQFwjcPVQ
your link seems to suggest she preferred the
Fugue Explainer for his witty conversation
and his provider potential?
No, she hated the length and complexity of the
works! The video is a perfect illustration of
the pointlessness of counterpoint! ;-)
I was unceremoniously dumped with a remark
"think how many hours of skating we lost
because of your silly symphonies!" (we
had actually listened to a cycle of
the symphonies 3-9).
I was introduced (in the sense of first hearing
of him) in college by a dorm mate who told me he
had an orgasm listening to Bruckner. I imagine
that could cost you a girlfriend also. Not to
mention embarrassing.
I cannot possibly imagine anyone having orgasms
while listening to Bruckner. It is the dourest
and most boring music ever composed. And think
of all the CO2 produced by the brass! ;-)
I only listen to Bruckner when I want to fall
asleep. The 8th conducted by Celibidache is a
more reliable sleeping medicine than anything
I have tried.
dk
My reaction to Bruckner is somewhere between yours and my friend's. :-)
dk
2018-11-06 14:28:42 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Frank Berger
Post by dk
Post by Frank Berger
Post by dk
Post by Herman
Post by dk
I mentioned earlier Bruckner made me lose a
girlfriend during high school years. A great
http://youtu.be/IuiQFwjcPVQ
your link seems to suggest she preferred the
Fugue Explainer for his witty conversation
and his provider potential?
No, she hated the length and complexity of the
works! The video is a perfect illustration of
the pointlessness of counterpoint! ;-)
I was unceremoniously dumped with a remark
"think how many hours of skating we lost
because of your silly symphonies!" (we
had actually listened to a cycle of
the symphonies 3-9).
I was introduced (in the sense of first hearing
of him) in college by a dorm mate who told me he
had an orgasm listening to Bruckner. I imagine
that could cost you a girlfriend also. Not to
mention embarrassing.
I cannot possibly imagine anyone having orgasms
while listening to Bruckner. It is the dourest
and most boring music ever composed. And think
of all the CO2 produced by the brass! ;-)
I only listen to Bruckner when I want to fall
asleep. The 8th conducted by Celibidache is a
more reliable sleeping medicine than anything
I have tried.
My reaction to Bruckner is somewhere between
yours and my friend's. :-)
There are infrequent moments when I do listen
to Bruckner. They typically occur when I feel
a need to dissect the structure of a complex,
contrapuntal work so I can see how all the
nuts and bolts fit together. This does not
happen often though.

dk
Ricardo Jimenez
2018-11-06 15:02:05 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by dk
There are infrequent moments when I do listen
to Bruckner. They typically occur when I feel
a need to dissect the structure of a complex,
contrapuntal work so I can see how all the
nuts and bolts fit together. This does not
happen often though.
My 2 cents on Bruckner. He does better than all the other 19th
century symphonic composers at producing a rich orchestral sonority in
tuttis - well Tchaikovsky is almost as good. He is noticeably lacking
in melodic invention and interesting use of woodwind instruments,
especially solos. I recently listened to the entire "Anton Bruckner:
The Collection" on Spotify. It even includes his piano music. I like
his choral music best. Mass #2 and Te Deum are great music. Their
length is limited by the text. Symphonies have too much contrapuntal
meandering. I do enjoy 7 and 8 more than the others.
Tatonik
2018-11-06 15:46:56 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Ricardo Jimenez
My 2 cents on Bruckner. He does better than all the other 19th
century symphonic composers at producing a rich orchestral sonority in
tuttis - well Tchaikovsky is almost as good. He is noticeably lacking
in melodic invention and interesting use of woodwind instruments,
The Collection" on Spotify. It even includes his piano music. I like
his choral music best. Mass #2 and Te Deum are great music. Their
length is limited by the text. Symphonies have too much contrapuntal
meandering. I do enjoy 7 and 8 more than the others.
One of my professors once said there used to be an argument among some
musicologists as to what the Three Bs should stand for. Apparently a
vocal minority was in favor of Bach, Beethoven, and Bruckner rather than
Bach, Beethoven, and Brahms.

One could take the inclusive approach and simply change it to the Four
Bs.

You have to wonder if musicologists have too much time on their hands.
MiNe109
2018-11-06 16:00:52 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Tatonik
Post by Ricardo Jimenez
My 2 cents on Bruckner. He does better than all the other 19th
century symphonic composers at producing a rich orchestral sonority in
tuttis - well Tchaikovsky is almost as good. He is noticeably lacking
in melodic invention and interesting use of woodwind instruments,
The Collection" on Spotify. It even includes his piano music. I like
his choral music best. Mass #2 and Te Deum are great music. Their
length is limited by the text. Symphonies have too much contrapuntal
meandering. I do enjoy 7 and 8 more than the others.
One of my professors once said there used to be an argument among some
musicologists as to what the Three Bs should stand for. Apparently a
vocal minority was in favor of Bach, Beethoven, and Bruckner rather than
Bach, Beethoven, and Brahms.
One could take the inclusive approach and simply change it to the Four
Bs.
Then you open the door to Bartok! Byrd, too?
Post by Tatonik
You have to wonder if musicologists have too much time on their hands.
When this is solved, they can take up the definition of 'planet.'

Stephen
Tatonik
2018-11-06 22:49:50 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by MiNe109
Post by Tatonik
Post by Ricardo Jimenez
My 2 cents on Bruckner. He does better than all the other 19th
century symphonic composers at producing a rich orchestral sonority in
tuttis - well Tchaikovsky is almost as good. He is noticeably lacking
in melodic invention and interesting use of woodwind instruments,
The Collection" on Spotify. It even includes his piano music. I like
his choral music best. Mass #2 and Te Deum are great music. Their
length is limited by the text. Symphonies have too much contrapuntal
meandering. I do enjoy 7 and 8 more than the others.
One of my professors once said there used to be an argument among some
musicologists as to what the Three Bs should stand for. Apparently a
vocal minority was in favor of Bach, Beethoven, and Bruckner rather than
Bach, Beethoven, and Brahms.
One could take the inclusive approach and simply change it to the Four
Bs.
Then you open the door to Bartok! Byrd, too?
Post by Tatonik
You have to wonder if musicologists have too much time on their hands.
When this is solved, they can take up the definition of 'planet.'
Stephen
One way to settle the B question is to search for instances of the names
in Google Books using the Google Ngram Viewer:

https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=Bach%2CBeethoven%2CBrahms%2CBruckner%2CBartok%2CBritten%2CBerlioz%2CWilliam+Byrd&year_start=1700&year_end=2008&corpus=15&smoothing=3&share=&direct_url=t1%3B%2CBach%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CBeethoven%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CBrahms%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CBruckner%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CBartok%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CBritten%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CBerlioz%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CWilliam%20Byrd%3B%2Cc0

Shorter link to the above:

https://tinyurl.com/ybw3muoy

Today the ranking stands as follows (searching works in English):

1. Bach
2. Beethoven
3. Brahms
4. Berlioz
5. Britten
6. Bruckner
7. Bartok
8. Byrd

Limit the search to British English and Britten overtakes Berlioz to
claim 4th place. Limit it to French and Berlioz jumps to 3rd. German,
and Bruckner jumps to 4th.

In Italian, Beethoven takes the top spot, bumping off Bach.

(It would appear I have something in common with musicologists: I have
too much time on my hands.)
dk
2018-11-07 01:30:02 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Tatonik
Post by MiNe109
Post by Tatonik
Post by Ricardo Jimenez
My 2 cents on Bruckner. He does better than all the other 19th
century symphonic composers at producing a rich orchestral sonority in
tuttis - well Tchaikovsky is almost as good. He is noticeably lacking
in melodic invention and interesting use of woodwind instruments,
The Collection" on Spotify. It even includes his piano music. I like
his choral music best. Mass #2 and Te Deum are great music. Their
length is limited by the text. Symphonies have too much contrapuntal
meandering. I do enjoy 7 and 8 more than the others.
One of my professors once said there used to be an argument among some
musicologists as to what the Three Bs should stand for. Apparently a
vocal minority was in favor of Bach, Beethoven, and Bruckner rather than
Bach, Beethoven, and Brahms.
One could take the inclusive approach and simply change it to the Four
Bs.
Then you open the door to Bartok! Byrd, too?
Post by Tatonik
You have to wonder if musicologists have too much time on their hands.
When this is solved, they can take up the definition of 'planet.'
Stephen
One way to settle the B question is to search for instances of the names
https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=Bach%2CBeethoven%2CBrahms%2CBruckner%2CBartok%2CBritten%2CBerlioz%2CWilliam+Byrd&year_start=1700&year_end=2008&corpus=15&smoothing=3&share=&direct_url=t1%3B%2CBach%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CBeethoven%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CBrahms%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CBruckner%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CBartok%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CBritten%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CBerlioz%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CWilliam%20Byrd%3B%2Cc0
https://tinyurl.com/ybw3muoy
1. Bach
2. Beethoven
3. Brahms
4. Berlioz
5. Britten
6. Bruckner
7. Bartok
8. Byrd
Limit the search to British English and Britten overtakes Berlioz to
claim 4th place. Limit it to French and Berlioz jumps to 3rd. German,
and Bruckner jumps to 4th.
In Italian, Beethoven takes the top spot, bumping off Bach.
(It would appear I have something in common with musicologists: I have
too much time on my hands.)
And perhaps too many keys under your fingers? ;-)

dk
dk
2018-11-07 01:36:39 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Tatonik
Post by MiNe109
Post by Tatonik
Post by Ricardo Jimenez
My 2 cents on Bruckner. He does better than all the other 19th
century symphonic composers at producing a rich orchestral sonority in
tuttis - well Tchaikovsky is almost as good. He is noticeably lacking
in melodic invention and interesting use of woodwind instruments,
The Collection" on Spotify. It even includes his piano music. I like
his choral music best. Mass #2 and Te Deum are great music. Their
length is limited by the text. Symphonies have too much contrapuntal
meandering. I do enjoy 7 and 8 more than the others.
One of my professors once said there used to be an argument among some
musicologists as to what the Three Bs should stand for. Apparently a
vocal minority was in favor of Bach, Beethoven, and Bruckner rather than
Bach, Beethoven, and Brahms.
One could take the inclusive approach and simply change it to the Four
Bs.
Then you open the door to Bartok! Byrd, too?
Post by Tatonik
You have to wonder if musicologists have too much time on their hands.
When this is solved, they can take up the definition of 'planet.'
Stephen
One way to settle the B question is to search for instances of the names
https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=Bach%2CBeethoven%2CBrahms%2CBruckner%2CBartok%2CBritten%2CBerlioz%2CWilliam+Byrd&year_start=1700&year_end=2008&corpus=15&smoothing=3&share=&direct_url=t1%3B%2CBach%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CBeethoven%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CBrahms%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CBruckner%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CBartok%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CBritten%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CBerlioz%3B%2Cc0%3B.t1%3B%2CWilliam%20Byrd%3B%2Cc0
https://tinyurl.com/ybw3muoy
1. Bach
2. Beethoven
3. Brahms
4. Berlioz
5. Britten
6. Bruckner
7. Bartok
8. Byrd
Limit the search to British English and Britten overtakes Berlioz to
claim 4th place. Limit it to French and Berlioz jumps to 3rd. German,
and Bruckner jumps to 4th.
In Italian, Beethoven takes the top spot, bumping off Bach.
Borodin? Balakirev? Boccherini? Buxtehude?

dk
MiNe109
2018-11-07 15:28:58 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by dk
Post by Tatonik
1. Bach
2. Beethoven
3. Brahms
4. Berlioz
5. Britten
6. Bruckner
7. Bartok
8. Byrd
Limit the search to British English and Britten overtakes Berlioz to
claim 4th place. Limit it to French and Berlioz jumps to 3rd. German,
and Bruckner jumps to 4th.
In Italian, Beethoven takes the top spot, bumping off Bach.
Borodin? Balakirev? Boccherini? Buxtehude?
We need more Italians! But it's hard to picture Busoni and Bellini up there.

Stephen
dk
2018-11-06 20:49:11 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Tatonik
You have to wonder if musicologists
have too much time on their hands.
I usually wonder what they
have between their ears! ;-)

dk
m***@gmail.com
2018-11-06 17:01:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by dk
Post by Frank Berger
Post by dk
Post by Herman
Post by dk
I mentioned earlier Bruckner made me lose a
girlfriend during high school years. A great
http://youtu.be/IuiQFwjcPVQ
your link seems to suggest she preferred the
Fugue Explainer for his witty conversation
and his provider potential?
No, she hated the length and complexity of the
works! The video is a perfect illustration of
the pointlessness of counterpoint! ;-)
I was unceremoniously dumped with a remark
"think how many hours of skating we lost
because of your silly symphonies!" (we
had actually listened to a cycle of
the symphonies 3-9).
I was introduced (in the sense of first hearing
of him) in college by a dorm mate who told me he
had an orgasm listening to Bruckner. I imagine
that could cost you a girlfriend also. Not to
mention embarrassing.
I cannot possibly imagine anyone having orgasms
while listening to Bruckner. It is the dourest
and most boring music ever composed. And think
of all the CO2 produced by the brass! ;-)
I only listen to Bruckner when I want to fall
asleep. The 8th conducted by Celibidache is a
more reliable sleeping medicine than anything
I have tried.
dk
Listening to Bruckner is like going down a street in Vienna and meeting a friend. He says " I have the most fascinating story to tell you, as a matter of fact its the most fascinating story you have ever heard!" He goes on and on telling you how wonderful the story is and then after an hour he says good bye and walks away. You stand there and realize you never heard the actual story. And that's what its like for me to listen to Bruckner - a lot if build ups with no core.
dk
2018-11-06 20:50:52 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by m***@gmail.com
Post by dk
Post by Frank Berger
Post by dk
Post by Herman
Post by dk
I mentioned earlier Bruckner made me lose a
girlfriend during high school years. A great
http://youtu.be/IuiQFwjcPVQ
your link seems to suggest she preferred the
Fugue Explainer for his witty conversation
and his provider potential?
No, she hated the length and complexity of the
works! The video is a perfect illustration of
the pointlessness of counterpoint! ;-)
I was unceremoniously dumped with a remark
"think how many hours of skating we lost
because of your silly symphonies!" (we
had actually listened to a cycle of
the symphonies 3-9).
I was introduced (in the sense of first hearing
of him) in college by a dorm mate who told me he
had an orgasm listening to Bruckner. I imagine
that could cost you a girlfriend also. Not to
mention embarrassing.
I cannot possibly imagine anyone having orgasms
while listening to Bruckner. It is the dourest
and most boring music ever composed. And think
of all the CO2 produced by the brass! ;-)
I only listen to Bruckner when I want to fall
asleep. The 8th conducted by Celibidache is a
more reliable sleeping medicine than anything
I have tried.
Listening to Bruckner is like going down a street
in Vienna and meeting a friend. He says " I have
the most fascinating story to tell you, as a matter
of fact its the most fascinating story you have ever
heard!" He goes on and on telling you how wonderful
the story is and then after an hour he says good bye
and walks away. You stand there and realize you never
heard the actual story. And that's what its like for
me to listen to Bruckner - a lot if build ups with
no core.
Isn't the journey supposed to be the reward?

dk
r***@gmail.com
2018-11-06 23:14:33 UTC
Reply
Permalink
I'd rather listen to Bruckner than Brahms or Beethoven (excepting the Eroica) any day of the week.

The 3 B's should be amended to read Bax, Bruckner and Bach. Or even Boulez, Berio, and Birtwistle as an alternative.

For me it is the journey that counts.

Ray Hall, Taree
O
2018-11-07 16:08:11 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by r***@gmail.com
I'd rather listen to Bruckner than Brahms or Beethoven (excepting the Eroica)
any day of the week.
The 3 B's should be amended to read Bax, Bruckner and Bach. Or even Boulez,
Berio, and Birtwistle as an alternative.
For me it is the journey that counts.
What? Poor Bizet is left out in the cold?

-Owen
r***@gmail.com
2018-11-07 17:47:51 UTC
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-For me it is the journey that counts.

--What? Poor Bizet is left out in the
--cold?

--Owen

Actually, for his L'Arlesienne and Carmen suites, I'd include him in any list.

Ray Hall, Taree
m***@gmail.com
2018-11-07 04:41:33 UTC
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Post by dk
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Post by dk
Post by Frank Berger
Post by dk
Post by Herman
Post by dk
I mentioned earlier Bruckner made me lose a
girlfriend during high school years. A great
http://youtu.be/IuiQFwjcPVQ
your link seems to suggest she preferred the
Fugue Explainer for his witty conversation
and his provider potential?
No, she hated the length and complexity of the
works! The video is a perfect illustration of
the pointlessness of counterpoint! ;-)
I was unceremoniously dumped with a remark
"think how many hours of skating we lost
because of your silly symphonies!" (we
had actually listened to a cycle of
the symphonies 3-9).
I was introduced (in the sense of first hearing
of him) in college by a dorm mate who told me he
had an orgasm listening to Bruckner. I imagine
that could cost you a girlfriend also. Not to
mention embarrassing.
I cannot possibly imagine anyone having orgasms
while listening to Bruckner. It is the dourest
and most boring music ever composed. And think
of all the CO2 produced by the brass! ;-)
I only listen to Bruckner when I want to fall
asleep. The 8th conducted by Celibidache is a
more reliable sleeping medicine than anything
I have tried.
Listening to Bruckner is like going down a street
in Vienna and meeting a friend. He says " I have
the most fascinating story to tell you, as a matter
of fact its the most fascinating story you have ever
heard!" He goes on and on telling you how wonderful
the story is and then after an hour he says good bye
and walks away. You stand there and realize you never
heard the actual story. And that's what its like for
me to listen to Bruckner - a lot if build ups with
no core.
Isn't the journey supposed to be the reward?
dk
Not if you wind up with musical blue balls
O
2018-11-07 16:07:37 UTC
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Post by dk
Post by m***@gmail.com
Listening to Bruckner is like going down a street
in Vienna and meeting a friend. He says " I have
the most fascinating story to tell you, as a matter
of fact its the most fascinating story you have ever
heard!" He goes on and on telling you how wonderful
the story is and then after an hour he says good bye
and walks away. You stand there and realize you never
heard the actual story. And that's what its like for
me to listen to Bruckner - a lot if build ups with
no core.
Isn't the journey supposed to be the reward?
Only when listening on an Apple iPod or iPhone.

-Owen
Oscar
2018-11-07 03:53:22 UTC
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Post by m***@gmail.com
Listening to Bruckner is like going down a street in Vienna and meeting a friend. He says " I have the most
fascinating story to tell you, as a matter of fact its the most fascinating story you have ever heard!" He goes
on and on telling you how wonderful the story is and then after an hour he says good bye and walks away.
You stand there and realize you never heard the actual story. And that's what its like for me to listen to
Bruckner - a lot if build ups with no core.
You out of yo' g.d. mind.
m***@gmail.com
2018-11-07 04:57:03 UTC
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Post by Oscar
Post by m***@gmail.com
Listening to Bruckner is like going down a street in Vienna and meeting a friend. He says " I have the most
fascinating story to tell you, as a matter of fact its the most fascinating story you have ever heard!" He goes
on and on telling you how wonderful the story is and then after an hour he says good bye and walks away.
You stand there and realize you never heard the actual story. And that's what its like for me to listen to
Bruckner - a lot if build ups with no core.
You out of yo' g.d. mind.
Not that I haven't tried with Bruckner - over and over. Big fan of the other German repertory and I actually like the Bruckner 4. But every time I have tried with the other symphonies my mind starts to wander after about half an hour and there never seems to be a long range view of the music . I'll try again with some of the Furt recordingss I have and I know some are classics e.g. the 8th????
Herman
2018-11-07 07:41:09 UTC
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Post by m***@gmail.com
Post by Oscar
Post by m***@gmail.com
Listening to Bruckner is like going down a street in Vienna and meeting a friend. He says " I have the most
fascinating story to tell you, as a matter of fact its the most fascinating story you have ever heard!" He goes
on and on telling you how wonderful the story is and then after an hour he says good bye and walks away.
You stand there and realize you never heard the actual story. And that's what its like for me to listen to
Bruckner - a lot if build ups with no core.
You out of yo' g.d. mind.
Not that I haven't tried with Bruckner - over and over. Big fan of the other German repertory and I actually like the Bruckner 4. But every time I have tried with the other symphonies my mind starts to wander after about half an hour and there never seems to be a long range view of the music . I'll try again with some of the Furt recordingss I have and I know some are classics e.g. the 8th????
It's really simple. Bruckner should be heard in the concert hall. Not at home with a remote control nearby.

I really like Bruckner, that is, I really like 6, 9 and 3, and 7 and 8 are masterpieces but I have heard those too often. But if I get to hear 6 and 9, each, once between now and 2025, by a first class orchestra, I'm happy.

This is no music you need to hear on a regular basis.

The stuff about "climaxes" is sophomoric reviewer talk, much encouraged by Bernstein who should have been allowed to come anywhere near Bruckner. Yes, there are louder and softer passages in Bruckner, as there are in most other post-classical era symphonic music. But the softer passages are just as important as the loud ones. This is especially the case in Bruckner's last symphony, where most of the "climaxes" are unloud. And the complaint, voiced above, that the socalled "climaxes" don't pay off or don't go anywhere shows the climx thinking is the wrong way of listening to this music.
Herman
2018-11-07 07:48:47 UTC
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Post by Herman
Post by m***@gmail.com
Post by Oscar
Post by m***@gmail.com
Listening to Bruckner is like going down a street in Vienna and meeting a friend. He says " I have the most
fascinating story to tell you, as a matter of fact its the most fascinating story you have ever heard!" He goes
on and on telling you how wonderful the story is and then after an hour he says good bye and walks away.
You stand there and realize you never heard the actual story. And that's what its like for me to listen to
Bruckner - a lot if build ups with no core.
You out of yo' g.d. mind.
Not that I haven't tried with Bruckner - over and over. Big fan of the other German repertory and I actually like the Bruckner 4. But every time I have tried with the other symphonies my mind starts to wander after about half an hour and there never seems to be a long range view of the music . I'll try again with some of the Furt recordingss I have and I know some are classics e.g. the 8th????
It's really simple. Bruckner should be heard in the concert hall. Not at home with a remote control nearby.
I really like Bruckner, that is, I really like 6, 9 and 3, and 7 and 8 are masterpieces but I have heard those too often. But if I get to hear 6 and 9, each, once between now and 2025, by a first class orchestra, I'm happy.
This is no music you need to hear on a regular basis.
The stuff about "climaxes" is sophomoric reviewer talk, much encouraged by Bernstein who should have been allowed to come anywhere near Bruckner. Yes, there are louder and softer passages in Bruckner, as there are in most other post-classical era symphonic music. But the softer passages are just as important as the loud ones. This is especially the case in Bruckner's last symphony, where most of the "climaxes" are unloud. And the complaint, voiced above, that the socalled "climaxes" don't pay off or don't go anywhere shows the climx thinking is the wrong way of listening to this music.
obviously I omitted the word "not" or "never" in the Bernstein sentence. Bernstein, the climax man, should never have been allowed to come anywhere near Bruckner's music.
dk
2018-11-07 09:42:50 UTC
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Post by Herman
obviously I omitted the word "not" or "never" in
the Bernstein sentence. Bernstein, the climax man,
should never have been allowed to come anywhere
near Bruckner's music.
Herman, the violin man, should never
have been allowed to post opinions
about pianists and piano music ;-)

dk
Herman
2018-11-07 10:01:51 UTC
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Post by dk
Herman, the violin man, should never
have been allowed to post opinions
about pianists and piano music ;-)
dk
that's why I only post facts about piano music.
m***@gmail.com
2018-11-07 13:16:37 UTC
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Post by Herman
Post by dk
Herman, the violin man, should never
have been allowed to post opinions
about pianists and piano music ;-)
dk
that's why I only post facts about piano music.
You also have a habit of making personal accusations against posters about things they never did.
dk
2018-11-07 15:00:01 UTC
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Post by Herman
Post by dk
Herman, the violin man, should never
have been allowed to post opinions
about pianists and piano music ;-)
that's why I only post facts about piano music.
Facts don't need to be "posted"!
Or did you mean "facts"? ;-)

dk
graham
2018-11-07 15:15:15 UTC
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Post by dk
Post by Herman
Post by dk
Herman, the violin man, should never
have been allowed to post opinions
about pianists and piano music ;-)
that's why I only post facts about piano music.
Facts don't need to be "posted"!
Or did you mean "facts"? ;-)
dk
Is there an alternative?
dk
2018-11-07 09:41:10 UTC
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Post by Herman
This is no music you need to hear on a regular basis.
Well, that is (or should be) better
left as a matter of personal choice.

There is a lot of music I listen to
often enough to call it a "regular
basis".

À chacun son (dé)goût.

dk
n***@gmail.com
2018-11-07 16:40:11 UTC
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The stuff about "climaxes" is sophomoric reviewer talk, important as the loud ones. This is especially the case in Bruckner's last symphony, where most of the "climaxes" are unloud. And the complaint, voiced above, that the socalled "climaxes" don't pay off or don't go anywhere shows the climx thinking is the wrong way of listening to this music.
For many years I thought listeners rightfully refer to a "climax" in the 7th Symphony adagio (present even in cymbel-less editions).
Jerry
2018-11-07 13:55:57 UTC
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Post by Oscar
Post by m***@gmail.com
Listening to Bruckner is like going down a street in Vienna and meeting a friend. He says " I have the most
fascinating story to tell you, as a matter of fact its the most fascinating story you have ever heard!" He goes
on and on telling you how wonderful the story is and then after an hour he says good bye and walks away.
You stand there and realize you never heard the actual story. And that's what its like for me to listen to
Bruckner - a lot if build ups with no core.
You out of yo' g.d. mind.
I'm with Oscar!

Jerry
Jerry
2018-11-07 14:06:47 UTC
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Correction. I was agreeing with the earlier post (Myers) but mistakenly
attributed it to Oscar.

The Bruckner 9th remains the only one that I can get through in one
sitting. That’s not the case with Mahler.

Jerry
Mr. Mike
2018-11-07 16:30:32 UTC
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Post by dk
I cannot possibly imagine anyone having orgasms
while listening to Bruckner. It is the dourest
and most boring music ever composed. And think
of all the CO2 produced by the brass! ;-)
LOL, a good reason to ban Bruckner, because of the threat to global
warming...
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