Discussion:
Aaron Rosand
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m***@gmail.com
2018-11-27 21:49:14 UTC
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I've been collecting classical recordings for over 50 years, so some of them go a long time without being heard. I pulled a dusty CD off the shelf today featuring violin encores played by Aaron Rosand, and it gave immense pleasure. He plays with a beautiful, unforced tone, has a technique that does everything the music requires without calling attention to itself, and he phrases like a great singer. It's called "The Violinist," and it's on a Vox-related label called Allegretto. Pianist Eileen Flissler aids and abets cleanly and with appropriate self-effacement. I see it's on Spotify, so listen for yourself. I will follow up with other Rosand recordings on Spotify. Rosand never had a huge career, but recorded a lot and kept busy with engagements and teaching positions. Do I remember correctly that Isaac Stern disliked Rosand and was an impediment to Rosand's career?

Mark
wkasimer
2018-11-27 22:01:35 UTC
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Post by m***@gmail.com
Do I remember correctly that Isaac Stern disliked Rosand and was an impediment to Rosand's career?
https://slippedisc.com/2014/07/high-explosive-aaron-rosand-accuses-isaac-stern-of-sabotaging-his-career/
MIFrost
2018-11-28 00:05:43 UTC
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Post by m***@gmail.com
I've been collecting classical recordings for over 50 years, so some of them go a long time without being heard. I pulled a dusty CD off the shelf today featuring violin encores played by Aaron Rosand, and it gave immense pleasure. He plays with a beautiful, unforced tone, has a technique that does everything the music requires without calling attention to itself, and he phrases like a great singer. It's called "The Violinist," and it's on a Vox-related label called Allegretto. Pianist Eileen Flissler aids and abets cleanly and with appropriate self-effacement. I see it's on Spotify, so listen for yourself. I will follow up with other Rosand recordings on Spotify. Rosand never had a huge career, but recorded a lot and kept busy with engagements and teaching positions. Do I remember correctly that Isaac Stern disliked Rosand and was an impediment to Rosand's career?
Mark
Try this. It's excellent, IMHO.
https://www.amazon.com/Beethoven-Complete-Violin-Sonatas/dp/B000001K74

MIFrost
c***@gmail.com
2018-11-28 00:26:09 UTC
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Post by MIFrost
Post by m***@gmail.com
I've been collecting classical recordings for over 50 years, so some of them go a long time without being heard. I pulled a dusty CD off the shelf today featuring violin encores played by Aaron Rosand, and it gave immense pleasure. He plays with a beautiful, unforced tone, has a technique that does everything the music requires without calling attention to itself, and he phrases like a great singer. It's called "The Violinist," and it's on a Vox-related label called Allegretto. Pianist Eileen Flissler aids and abets cleanly and with appropriate self-effacement. I see it's on Spotify, so listen for yourself. I will follow up with other Rosand recordings on Spotify. Rosand never had a huge career, but recorded a lot and kept busy with engagements and teaching positions. Do I remember correctly that Isaac Stern disliked Rosand and was an impediment to Rosand's career?
Mark
Try this. It's excellent, IMHO.
https://www.amazon.com/Beethoven-Complete-Violin-Sonatas/dp/B000001K74
MIFrost
Agreed, although my particular Rosand faves are this set: https://www.amazon.com/Rosand-Joachim-Enesco-Godard-Wieniawski/dp/B000001K46/

and his all-Sarasate disc (https://www.amazon.com/Carmen-Fantasy-Zigeunerweisen-Pablo-Sarasate/dp/B000001KAR/), equaled only by Ricci, whose stellar recording of the Spanish Dances has not been reissued officially on CD afaik.

AC
O
2018-11-28 15:27:06 UTC
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Post by m***@gmail.com
I've been collecting classical recordings for over 50 years, so some of them
go a long time without being heard. I pulled a dusty CD off the shelf today
featuring violin encores played by Aaron Rosand, and it gave immense
pleasure. He plays with a beautiful, unforced tone, has a technique that does
everything the music requires without calling attention to itself, and he
phrases like a great singer. It's called "The Violinist," and it's on a
Vox-related label called Allegretto. Pianist Eileen Flissler aids and abets
cleanly and with appropriate self-effacement. I see it's on Spotify, so
listen for yourself. I will follow up with other Rosand recordings on
Spotify. Rosand never had a huge career, but recorded a lot and kept busy
with engagements and teaching positions. Do I remember correctly that Isaac
Stern disliked Rosand and was an impediment to Rosand's career?
On Spotify, it's:

https://open.spotify.com/album/1wSJAJ2nIcwg8WUIJhErIV?si=jKCkRFOcR1yg6iM
7tdLlyQ

Nicely played.

-Owen
AB
2018-11-28 20:34:28 UTC
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Post by O
Post by m***@gmail.com
I've been collecting classical recordings for over 50 years, so some of them
go a long time without being heard. I pulled a dusty CD off the shelf today
featuring violin encores played by Aaron Rosand, and it gave immense
pleasure. He plays with a beautiful, unforced tone, has a technique that does
everything the music requires without calling attention to itself, and he
phrases like a great singer. It's called "The Violinist," and it's on a
Vox-related label called Allegretto. Pianist Eileen Flissler aids and abets
cleanly and with appropriate self-effacement. I see it's on Spotify, so
listen for yourself. I will follow up with other Rosand recordings on
Spotify. Rosand never had a huge career, but recorded a lot and kept busy
with engagements and teaching positions. Do I remember correctly that Isaac
Stern disliked Rosand and was an impediment to Rosand's career?
https://open.spotify.com/album/1wSJAJ2nIcwg8WUIJhErIV?si=jKCkRFOcR1yg6iM
7tdLlyQ
Nicely played.
-Owen
heard quite a number of his recordings... IMO, the playing is not of the highest level. his technique is really not effortless. lots of little slips, tone is not full.

AB
O
2018-11-29 17:41:47 UTC
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Post by AB
Post by O
Post by m***@gmail.com
I've been collecting classical recordings for over 50 years, so some of them
go a long time without being heard. I pulled a dusty CD off the shelf today
featuring violin encores played by Aaron Rosand, and it gave immense
pleasure. He plays with a beautiful, unforced tone, has a technique that does
everything the music requires without calling attention to itself, and he
phrases like a great singer. It's called "The Violinist," and it's on a
Vox-related label called Allegretto. Pianist Eileen Flissler aids and abets
cleanly and with appropriate self-effacement. I see it's on Spotify, so
listen for yourself. I will follow up with other Rosand recordings on
Spotify. Rosand never had a huge career, but recorded a lot and kept busy
with engagements and teaching positions. Do I remember correctly that Isaac
Stern disliked Rosand and was an impediment to Rosand's career?
https://open.spotify.com/album/1wSJAJ2nIcwg8WUIJhErIV?si=jKCkRFOcR1yg6iM
7tdLlyQ
Nicely played.
-Owen
heard quite a number of his recordings... IMO, the playing is not of the
highest level. his technique is really not effortless. lots of little slips, tone is not full.
You don't happen to also go by the name, Isaac Stern, do you?

-Owen
m***@gmail.com
2018-11-29 17:56:11 UTC
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Post by O
You don't happen to also go by the name, Isaac Stern, do you?
-Owen
Stern's tone has always repelled me.
Herman
2018-11-29 18:35:22 UTC
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Post by m***@gmail.com
Post by O
You don't happen to also go by the name, Isaac Stern, do you?
-Owen
Stern's tone has always repelled me.
well, you can live in peace now.

like many great violinists of his generation he did not seem to have a real solid technical foundation, which is why his tone and vibrato (pretty much same thing) started to degenerate fairly soon.
AB
2018-11-29 20:44:48 UTC
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Post by Herman
Post by m***@gmail.com
Post by O
You don't happen to also go by the name, Isaac Stern, do you?
-Owen
Stern's tone has always repelled me.
well, you can live in peace now.
like many great violinists of his generation he did not seem to have a real solid technical foundation, which is why his tone and vibrato (pretty much same thing) started to degenerate fairly soon.
Herman
how could one be considered a 'great violinist' if you dont have a solid technical foundation?????.
FYI tone and vibrato are not he same thing, at least not on the bassoon:-)

AB
O
2018-11-29 21:08:38 UTC
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Post by AB
Post by Herman
Post by m***@gmail.com
Post by O
You don't happen to also go by the name, Isaac Stern, do you?
-Owen
Stern's tone has always repelled me.
well, you can live in peace now.
like many great violinists of his generation he did not seem to have a real
solid technical foundation, which is why his tone and vibrato (pretty much
same thing) started to degenerate fairly soon.
Herman
how could one be considered a 'great violinist' if you dont have a solid
technical foundation?????.
You become considered a 'great violinist' if your marketing department
dares to put that moniker on your record jacket. (And gets away with
it!)

-Owen
AB
2018-11-29 21:15:44 UTC
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Post by O
Post by AB
Post by Herman
Post by m***@gmail.com
Post by O
You don't happen to also go by the name, Isaac Stern, do you?
-Owen
Stern's tone has always repelled me.
well, you can live in peace now.
like many great violinists of his generation he did not seem to have a real
solid technical foundation, which is why his tone and vibrato (pretty much
same thing) started to degenerate fairly soon.
Herman
how could one be considered a 'great violinist' if you dont have a solid
technical foundation?????.
You become considered a 'great violinist' if your marketing department
dares to put that moniker on your record jacket. (And gets away with
it!)
-Owen
I suppose then that Trump could also be considered a great President if he is marketed so :-)
AB
Frank Berger
2018-11-29 21:25:27 UTC
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Post by AB
Post by O
Post by AB
Post by Herman
Post by m***@gmail.com
Post by O
You don't happen to also go by the name, Isaac Stern, do you?
-Owen
Stern's tone has always repelled me.
well, you can live in peace now.
like many great violinists of his generation he did not seem to have a real
solid technical foundation, which is why his tone and vibrato (pretty much
same thing) started to degenerate fairly soon.
Herman
how could one be considered a 'great violinist' if you dont have a solid
technical foundation?????.
You become considered a 'great violinist' if your marketing department
dares to put that moniker on your record jacket. (And gets away with
it!)
-Owen
I suppose then that Trump could also be considered a great President if he is marketed so :-)
AB
Depends who you ask. And when. One violinist's intonation may be off but
he plays with soul. Another's intonation is perfect but he plays
without feeling. Can either one be great? Do you have be great in all
aspects of playing? Maybe Trump's policies and accomplishments will
someday be widely viewed as successful. Eventually it will be largey
forgotten that he's an asshole. Can you be an asshole and be a great
president? The 50% who didn't and won't vote for him will never think
of him as a great president no matter what. Who do you ask? Historians
a hundred years from now?
Bozo
2018-11-30 01:01:55 UTC
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Post by Frank Berger
Who do you ask? Historians
a hundred years from now?
Trump can fool all the people some of the time.Thankfully, not me, nor do I need to wait.Pity Chamberlain waited in 1938.
Frank Berger
2018-11-30 01:44:39 UTC
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Post by Bozo
Post by Frank Berger
Who do you ask? Historians
a hundred years from now?
Trump can fool all the people some of the time.Thankfully, not me, nor do I need to wait.Pity Chamberlain waited in 1938.
What have you been drinking?
m***@gmail.com
2018-11-30 19:29:49 UTC
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Post by Bozo
Pity Chamberlain waited in 1938.
Read an interesting take on Chamberlain recently that while his public display of peace-making ruined his reputation forever, England was at the time in no condition to wage a war, and his act bought them time to build up their arsenal. If accurate, that's pretty important.
Frank Berger
2018-11-30 20:14:02 UTC
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Post by m***@gmail.com
Post by Bozo
Pity Chamberlain waited in 1938.
Read an interesting take on Chamberlain recently that while his public display of peace-making ruined his reputation forever, England was at the time in no condition to wage a war, and his act bought them time to build up their arsenal. If accurate, that's pretty important.
Wilt would not have been less successful than Neville.
g***@gmail.com
2018-12-01 03:25:06 UTC
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Post by Bozo
Pity Chamberlain waited in 1938.
Read an interesting take on Chamberlain recently that while his public display of peace-making ruined his reputation forever, England was at the time in no condition to wage a war, and his act bought them time to build up their arsenal. If accurate, that's pretty important.
(Recent tv program on Chamberlain):

https://www.c-span.org/video/?439979-1/robert-harris-discusses-1938-chamberlain-hitler-munich-summit
m***@gmail.com
2018-12-01 03:51:26 UTC
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Post by Bozo
Pity Chamberlain waited in 1938.
Read an interesting take on Chamberlain recently that while his public display of peace-making ruined his reputation forever, England was at the time in no condition to wage a war, and his act bought them time to build up their arsenal. If accurate, that's pretty important.
Hmmm Like Putins Hitler and Prince Mohammed bin Salmans Mussolini vs. 45's Chamberlain
m***@gmail.com
2018-12-01 03:54:30 UTC
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Post by Bozo
Pity Chamberlain waited in 1938.
Read an interesting take on Chamberlain recently that while his public display of peace-making ruined his reputation forever, England was at the time in no condition to wage a war, and his act bought them time to build up their arsenal. If accurate, that's pretty important.
But would it have been war in 1938 or would Hitler have backed down from his demands if shown some forcible pushback and England would still have time to arm
r***@gmail.com
2018-12-01 13:05:45 UTC
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Post by m***@gmail.com
Post by Bozo
Pity Chamberlain waited in 1938.
Read an interesting take on Chamberlain recently that while his public display of peace-making ruined his reputation forever, England was at the time in no condition to wage a war, and his act bought them time to build up their arsenal. If accurate, that's pretty important.
I might well have written it. While I was a student at Oxford the Conservative Association offered a meeting with a former Prime Minister- Sir Alec Douglas-Home. He was at Munich, as a junior Foreign Office minister. Before going to Munich Chamberlain had met with the Chiefs of Staff. The RAF had 20 Spitfires ready to fight, and the rest of the fighters had serious problems. The Civil Air Defence was unready. There were barrage balloons, but few AA batteries able to reach German flights expected to be at high altitude. The Navy could be ready to fight in 1939, but in 1938 only had crews and ready to sail ships for about 20% of the fleet. The Army likewise had little modern equipment, and its peacetime strength was low.
Chamberlain also had an assessment of the likely losses due to German air attack. Based on what had been observed in the Spanish Civil War (Guernica), the expectation was 641000 casualties in London alone in the first 3 months. (These details are from a novelised account of the meeting: Robert Harris's Munich. It agrees with what I heard in Oxford but adds a lot more detail.)
BY 1939 Britain had radar, a despatch system for defensive RAF flight, more aircraft than the Luftwaffe, and produced aircraft at a rate Germany never matched. It had coastal defences, AA defences, a fully manned Navy, and a plan for dealing with bombing by civil defence, bomb shelters for the population, and a plan to evacuate children from the cities to the country, with their teachers.
More than half of government spending after, and in the period immediately before, Munich, was on war preparation.
These plans all worked. When the war came in 1939 my parents' education finished. Their teachers and many fellow students were evacuated, but neither set of grandparents let them go. My mother started work next door to the Spitfire factory- an obvious target- and the whole area was bombed intensively as the Luftwaffe could manage. An aunt who was evacuated wrote a letter to me and her sons about the experience: she was in the country 20 miles from home, and one night her hosts took her outside. The sky was red, and they told her 'That's Birmingham.'
As a by-product, the arrangements for getting medical care to evacuees (children with no money or family around) later became the nucleus of the NHS. Another impetus for the NHS was the discovery that some 30% of called-up men were unfit for military service. It wasn't socialism: it was really about having a 'fighting-fit' population, just like the German system Bismarck introduced in 1870 or so.
O
2018-12-03 16:15:47 UTC
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Post by r***@gmail.com
Post by m***@gmail.com
Post by Bozo
Pity Chamberlain waited in 1938.
Read an interesting take on Chamberlain recently that while his public
display of peace-making ruined his reputation forever, England was at the
time in no condition to wage a war, and his act bought them time to build
up their arsenal. If accurate, that's pretty important.
I might well have written it. While I was a student at Oxford the
Conservative Association offered a meeting with a former Prime Minister- Sir
Alec Douglas-Home. He was at Munich, as a junior Foreign Office minister.
Before going to Munich Chamberlain had met with the Chiefs of Staff. The RAF
had 20 Spitfires ready to fight, and the rest of the fighters had serious
problems. The Civil Air Defence was unready. There were barrage balloons,
but few AA batteries able to reach German flights expected to be at high
altitude. The Navy could be ready to fight in 1939, but in 1938 only had
crews and ready to sail ships for about 20% of the fleet. The Army likewise
had little modern equipment, and its peacetime strength was low.
Chamberlain also had an assessment of the likely losses due to German air
attack. Based on what had been observed in the Spanish Civil War (Guernica),
the expectation was 641000 casualties in London alone in the first 3 months.
(These details are from a novelised account of the meeting: Robert Harris's
Munich. It agrees with what I heard in Oxford but adds a lot more detail.)
BY 1939 Britain had radar, a despatch system for defensive RAF flight, more
aircraft than the Luftwaffe, and produced aircraft at a rate Germany never
matched. It had coastal defences, AA defences, a fully manned Navy, and a
plan for dealing with bombing by civil defence, bomb shelters for the
population, and a plan to evacuate children from the cities to the country,
with their teachers.
More than half of government spending after, and in the period immediately
before, Munich, was on war preparation.
These plans all worked. When the war came in 1939 my parents' education
finished. Their teachers and many fellow students were evacuated, but neither
set of grandparents let them go. My mother started work next door to the
Spitfire factory- an obvious target- and the whole area was bombed
intensively as the Luftwaffe could manage. An aunt who was evacuated wrote a
letter to me and her sons about the experience: she was in the country 20
miles from home, and one night her hosts took her outside. The sky was red,
and they told her 'That's Birmingham.'
As a by-product, the arrangements for getting medical care to evacuees
(children with no money or family around) later became the nucleus of the
NHS. Another impetus for the NHS was the discovery that some 30% of called-up
men were unfit for military service. It wasn't socialism: it was really
about having a 'fighting-fit' population, just like the German system
Bismarck introduced in 1870 or so.
Interesting post. I think we tend to oversimplify history to make it
into more digestible chunks, while the real facts behind the moves are
a lot more subtle and significant than we think.

-Owen
Mark Zimmer
2018-12-05 17:07:43 UTC
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Post by r***@gmail.com
Post by m***@gmail.com
Post by Bozo
Pity Chamberlain waited in 1938.
Read an interesting take on Chamberlain recently that while his public display of peace-making ruined his reputation forever, England was at the time in no condition to wage a war, and his act bought them time to build up their arsenal. If accurate, that's pretty important.
I might well have written it. While I was a student at Oxford the Conservative Association offered a meeting with a former Prime Minister- Sir Alec Douglas-Home. He was at Munich, as a junior Foreign Office minister. Before going to Munich Chamberlain had met with the Chiefs of Staff. The RAF had 20 Spitfires ready to fight, and the rest of the fighters had serious problems. The Civil Air Defence was unready. There were barrage balloons, but few AA batteries able to reach German flights expected to be at high altitude. The Navy could be ready to fight in 1939, but in 1938 only had crews and ready to sail ships for about 20% of the fleet. The Army likewise had little modern equipment, and its peacetime strength was low.
Chamberlain also had an assessment of the likely losses due to German air attack. Based on what had been observed in the Spanish Civil War (Guernica), the expectation was 641000 casualties in London alone in the first 3 months. (These details are from a novelised account of the meeting: Robert Harris's Munich. It agrees with what I heard in Oxford but adds a lot more detail.)
BY 1939 Britain had radar, a despatch system for defensive RAF flight, more aircraft than the Luftwaffe, and produced aircraft at a rate Germany never matched. It had coastal defences, AA defences, a fully manned Navy, and a plan for dealing with bombing by civil defence, bomb shelters for the population, and a plan to evacuate children from the cities to the country, with their teachers.
More than half of government spending after, and in the period immediately before, Munich, was on war preparation.
These plans all worked. When the war came in 1939 my parents' education finished. Their teachers and many fellow students were evacuated, but neither set of grandparents let them go. My mother started work next door to the Spitfire factory- an obvious target- and the whole area was bombed intensively as the Luftwaffe could manage. An aunt who was evacuated wrote a letter to me and her sons about the experience: she was in the country 20 miles from home, and one night her hosts took her outside. The sky was red, and they told her 'That's Birmingham.'
As a by-product, the arrangements for getting medical care to evacuees (children with no money or family around) later became the nucleus of the NHS. Another impetus for the NHS was the discovery that some 30% of called-up men were unfit for military service. It wasn't socialism: it was really about having a 'fighting-fit' population, just like the German system Bismarck introduced in 1870 or so.
While I'd agree with much of this, Chamberlain also was not above being completely bamboozled. A few months before Munich, he was also busy engaging in appeasement with the Irish, and many years ago I wrote my history thesis on that event. When the Irish threatened to open their ports to German U-boats, Chamberlain basically gave them everything they wanted. Reading the declassified minutes of both the Irish and British Cabinets, it was clear that the Irish were entirely bluffing; they had no intention whatsoever of cooperating with Hitler. But it got them what they wanted, including a promise of complete independence, which eventually came after the war. Chamberlain did manage to avoid the threat of a second front in the rear, which would have been very bad but was also purely fantasy. I suppose one could charitably say that even a tiny risk of that happening was unacceptable.
r***@gmail.com
2018-12-05 23:07:49 UTC
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Post by Mark Zimmer
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Post by m***@gmail.com
Post by Bozo
Pity Chamberlain waited in 1938.
Read an interesting take on Chamberlain recently that while his public display of peace-making ruined his reputation forever, England was at the time in no condition to wage a war, and his act bought them time to build up their arsenal. If accurate, that's pretty important.
I might well have written it. While I was a student at Oxford the Conservative Association offered a meeting with a former Prime Minister- Sir Alec Douglas-Home. He was at Munich, as a junior Foreign Office minister. Before going to Munich Chamberlain had met with the Chiefs of Staff. The RAF had 20 Spitfires ready to fight, and the rest of the fighters had serious problems. The Civil Air Defence was unready. There were barrage balloons, but few AA batteries able to reach German flights expected to be at high altitude. The Navy could be ready to fight in 1939, but in 1938 only had crews and ready to sail ships for about 20% of the fleet. The Army likewise had little modern equipment, and its peacetime strength was low.
Chamberlain also had an assessment of the likely losses due to German air attack. Based on what had been observed in the Spanish Civil War (Guernica), the expectation was 641000 casualties in London alone in the first 3 months. (These details are from a novelised account of the meeting: Robert Harris's Munich. It agrees with what I heard in Oxford but adds a lot more detail.)
BY 1939 Britain had radar, a despatch system for defensive RAF flight, more aircraft than the Luftwaffe, and produced aircraft at a rate Germany never matched. It had coastal defences, AA defences, a fully manned Navy, and a plan for dealing with bombing by civil defence, bomb shelters for the population, and a plan to evacuate children from the cities to the country, with their teachers.
More than half of government spending after, and in the period immediately before, Munich, was on war preparation.
These plans all worked. When the war came in 1939 my parents' education finished. Their teachers and many fellow students were evacuated, but neither set of grandparents let them go. My mother started work next door to the Spitfire factory- an obvious target- and the whole area was bombed intensively as the Luftwaffe could manage. An aunt who was evacuated wrote a letter to me and her sons about the experience: she was in the country 20 miles from home, and one night her hosts took her outside. The sky was red, and they told her 'That's Birmingham.'
As a by-product, the arrangements for getting medical care to evacuees (children with no money or family around) later became the nucleus of the NHS. Another impetus for the NHS was the discovery that some 30% of called-up men were unfit for military service. It wasn't socialism: it was really about having a 'fighting-fit' population, just like the German system Bismarck introduced in 1870 or so.
While I'd agree with much of this, Chamberlain also was not above being completely bamboozled. A few months before Munich, he was also busy engaging in appeasement with the Irish, and many years ago I wrote my history thesis on that event. When the Irish threatened to open their ports to German U-boats, Chamberlain basically gave them everything they wanted. Reading the declassified minutes of both the Irish and British Cabinets, it was clear that the Irish were entirely bluffing; they had no intention whatsoever of cooperating with Hitler. But it got them what they wanted, including a promise of complete independence, which eventually came after the war. Chamberlain did manage to avoid the threat of a second front in the rear, which would have been very bad but was also purely fantasy. I suppose one could charitably say that even a tiny risk of that happening was unacceptable.
It was not inconceivable. The 1916 Easter Rising in Dublin was funded and equipped by the Kaiser's Germany. Why take the chance?
Frank Berger
2018-11-29 21:19:41 UTC
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Post by O
You don't happen to also go by the name, Isaac Stern, do you?
-Owen
Stern's tone has always repelled me.
well, you can live in peace now.
like many great violinists of his generation he did not seem to have a real
solid technical foundation, which is why his tone and vibrato (pretty much
same thing) started to degenerate fairly soon.
Herman
how could one be considered a 'great violinist' if you dont have a solid
technical foundation?????.
You become considered a 'great violinist' if your marketing department
dares to put that moniker on your record jacket. (And gets away with
it!)
Meaning people buy your recordings and attend your concerts?
Herman
2018-11-30 07:44:53 UTC
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Post by AB
Herman
how could one be considered a 'great violinist' if you dont have a solid technical foundation?????.
FYI tone and vibrato are not he same thing, at least not on the bassoon:-)
AB
Well, it's more like the technical foundation got worn out in the Sixties, in Stern's case. He wasn't a fanatical practicer. In order to keep your technique up to the highest level, you need to practice at least four to six hours a day, including an hour of mind-numbing scales. Stern didn't do that, and he spent that time working on his power network, having lunches with people that mattered and making phone calls. (Rosand mentions that Stern was keeping an eye on his concert schedule and had called every all the people he ran into just to control and limit Rosand - this may be a paranoid exaggeration, but there was something to it).

I recently saw part of a 1972 Mendelssohn Stern did in Amsterdam, Haitink conducting. It's hit and miss; there's a beautiful tone coming out of that violin, but the intonation is crap most of the time. And he had 25 years to go yet.

A lot of Stern's fame and status as a great violinist came from his ability to look genial and charming on camera. Same thing with other CBS artists of that time, Glenn Gould and Leonard Bernstein.
g***@gmail.com
2018-11-30 14:33:05 UTC
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Post by AB
Herman
how could one be considered a 'great violinist' if you dont have a solid technical foundation?????.
FYI tone and vibrato are not he same thing, at least not on the bassoon:-)
AB
Well, it's more like the technical foundation got worn out in the Sixties, in Stern's case. He wasn't a fanatical practicer. In order to keep your technique up to the highest level, you need to practice at least four to six hours a day, including an hour of mind-numbing scales...
- If I don't practice one day, I know it; two days, the critics know it; three days, the public knows it.

Jascha Heifetz
n***@gmail.com
2018-11-30 17:05:47 UTC
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Post by g***@gmail.com
Post by AB
Herman
how could one be considered a 'great violinist' if you dont have a solid technical foundation?????.
FYI tone and vibrato are not he same thing, at least not on the bassoon:-)
AB
Well, it's more like the technical foundation got worn out in the Sixties, in Stern's case. He wasn't a fanatical practicer. In order to keep your technique up to the highest level, you need to practice at least four to six hours a day, including an hour of mind-numbing scales...
- If I don't practice one day, I know it; two days, the critics know it; three days, the public knows it.
Jascha Heifetz
Many older individuals (including dogs) suffer with stiff joints and arthritis pain, with not too much help from meds. If they practiced 24 hours a day it would be to no avail.
l***@gmail.com
2018-12-04 20:43:32 UTC
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Post by g***@gmail.com
Post by AB
Herman
how could one be considered a 'great violinist' if you dont have a solid technical foundation?????.
FYI tone and vibrato are not he same thing, at least not on the bassoon:-)
AB
Well, it's more like the technical foundation got worn out in the Sixties, in Stern's case. He wasn't a fanatical practicer. In order to keep your technique up to the highest level, you need to practice at least four to six hours a day, including an hour of mind-numbing scales...
- If I don't practice one day, I know it; two days, the critics know it; three days, the public knows it.
Jascha Heifetz
NO, no, no. Rachmaninov said that.

Mort Linder
g***@gmail.com
2018-12-04 20:46:12 UTC
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Post by g***@gmail.com
Post by AB
Herman
how could one be considered a 'great violinist' if you dont have a solid technical foundation?????.
FYI tone and vibrato are not he same thing, at least not on the bassoon:-)
AB
Well, it's more like the technical foundation got worn out in the Sixties, in Stern's case. He wasn't a fanatical practicer. In order to keep your technique up to the highest level, you need to practice at least four to six hours a day, including an hour of mind-numbing scales...
- If I don't practice one day, I know it; two days, the critics know it; three days, the public knows it.
Jascha Heifetz
NO, no, no. Rachmaninov said that.
Mort Linder
So is this wrong?:

https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&sa=1&ei=qeYGXM-RGMWb0wLa6ZzoAw&q=jascha+heifetz+quotes&oq=quotes+heifetz&gs_l=img.1.0.0i8i30l2.175882.180203..181963...0.0..0.182.1977.17j4......1....1..gws-wiz-img.......0j35i39j0i30j0i5i30j0i67.LuikSETZVDM#imgrc=_jB7oHSf3c4twM:
HT
2018-12-04 21:02:55 UTC
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Post by l***@gmail.com
NO, no, no. Rachmaninov said that.
Wasn't it Rubinstein? Perhaps he heard it from Rachmaninoff? Did they ever meet each other?

Henk
Herman
2018-12-04 21:29:50 UTC
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Post by HT
Post by l***@gmail.com
NO, no, no. Rachmaninov said that.
Wasn't it Rubinstein? Perhaps he heard it from Rachmaninoff? Did they ever meet each other?
Henk
why discuss the veracity of the quotebots quotes?

It's best to ignore him.
JohnGavin
2018-12-04 23:31:15 UTC
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Wasn't it Rubinstein? Perhaps he heard it from Rachmaninoff? Did they ever meet each other?

Henk


I thought it was said by Godowsky!
HT
2018-12-05 07:21:06 UTC
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Post by JohnGavin
I thought it was said by Godowsky!
It was certainly not Malcuzynski - who once said on Dutch radio that as a young man he did not go on holidays out of fear of losing his technique. Later he noticed that fourteen days without his daily exercises was do-able

Henk
AB
2018-12-05 15:19:38 UTC
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Post by HT
Post by JohnGavin
I thought it was said by Godowsky!
It was certainly not Malcuzynski - who once said on Dutch radio that as a young man he did not go on holidays out of fear of losing his technique. Later he noticed that fourteen days without his daily exercises was do-able
Henk
I suspect that daily practice is more important for violin than piano

AB
Herman
2018-12-05 17:22:21 UTC
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Post by AB
I suspect that daily practice is more important for violin than piano
AB
yes it is.

after all, with a piano all you have to do is change your name to something Russian-sounding and push the keys.
AB
2018-12-05 20:05:42 UTC
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Post by Herman
Post by AB
I suspect that daily practice is more important for violin than piano
AB
yes it is.
after all, with a piano all you have to do is change your name to something Russian-sounding and push the keys.
like a player-piano, right?
AB
HT
2018-12-05 20:35:00 UTC
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Post by AB
I suspect that daily practice is more important for violin than piano
With string so much can go so horribly wrong. Also because the audience is as much a victim of a train wreck as the performer. Listen to Perlman's Mendelssohn on YT.

Henk
Tatonik
2018-12-05 23:52:54 UTC
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Post by HT
Post by AB
I suspect that daily practice is more important for violin than piano
With string so much can go so horribly wrong. Also because the audience is
as much a victim of a train wreck as the performer. Listen to Perlman's
Mendelssohn on YT.
Henk
This one?


AB
2018-12-06 00:52:44 UTC
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Post by Tatonik
Post by HT
Post by AB
I suspect that daily practice is more important for violin than piano
With string so much can go so horribly wrong. Also because the audience is
as much a victim of a train wreck as the performer. Listen to Perlman's
Mendelssohn on YT.
Henk
This one?
http://youtu.be/7m08JOODCI0
some kind of joke......
AB
2018-12-06 00:53:29 UTC
Reply
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Post by HT
Post by AB
I suspect that daily practice is more important for violin than piano
With string so much can go so horribly wrong. Also because the audience is as much a victim of a train wreck as the performer. Listen to Perlman's Mendelssohn on YT.
Henk
that is a joke....
AB
HT
2018-12-06 08:15:59 UTC
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Post by AB
Post by HT
With string so much can go so horribly wrong. Also because the audience is as much a victim of a train wreck as the performer. Listen to Perlman's Mendelssohn on YT.
Henk
that is a joke....
Certainly not! Nothing hurts the ears as much as listening to a fiddler who plays out of tune. If Horowitz misses all the jumps in a Schumann-fantasie, it only gives the audience something to talk about during the break.

Henk
graham
2018-12-06 15:24:20 UTC
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Post by HT
Post by AB
Post by HT
With string so much can go so horribly wrong. Also because the audience is as much a victim of a train wreck as the performer. Listen to Perlman's Mendelssohn on YT.
Henk
that is a joke....
Certainly not! Nothing hurts the ears as much as listening to a fiddler who plays out of tune. If Horowitz misses all the jumps in a Schumann-fantasie, it only gives the audience something to talk about during the break.
Henk
The first time I saw/heard Perlman was at a concert in London in 1969 or
1970. He was the soloist with the ECO in the 4 Seasons. He "underlined"
quite a number of notes and, unfortunately, in my seat off to the side,
I was close to the back desk of the first violins. Every time Perlman
played a bum note, one of them looked at his partner with a look of
disgust. It was difficult to ignore.
Herman
2018-12-06 15:39:19 UTC
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Post by graham
The first time I saw/heard Perlman was at a concert in London in 1969 or
1970. He was the soloist with the ECO in the 4 Seasons. He "underlined"
quite a number of notes and, unfortunately, in my seat off to the side,
I was close to the back desk of the first violins. Every time Perlman
played a bum note, one of them looked at his partner with a look of
disgust. It was difficult to ignore.
The Mendelssohn youtube that was mentioned is a prank. It's a video of IP playing Mendelssohn in his usual 'aren't we havin' fun?' way while some clever clogs plays horribly off pitch over it. It's quite clever, 'cause the wrong notes are in exact sync with the video.

As to your memory of Perlman in 1969 / 70. I can well imagine him playing in an exaggerated emphatic manner. I'm a little suprised he would play a lot of wrong notes, since at that time he was, technically, a really good violinist - just not my cuppa.
n***@gmail.com
2018-12-06 15:58:52 UTC
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Post by Herman
Post by graham
The first time I saw/heard Perlman was at a concert in London in 1969 or
1970. He was the soloist with the ECO in the 4 Seasons. He "underlined"
quite a number of notes and, unfortunately, in my seat off to the side,
I was close to the back desk of the first violins. Every time Perlman
played a bum note, one of them looked at his partner with a look of
disgust. It was difficult to ignore.
The Mendelssohn youtube that was mentioned is a prank. It's a video of IP playing Mendelssohn in his usual 'aren't we havin' fun?' way while some clever clogs plays horribly off pitch over it. It's quite clever, 'cause the wrong notes are in exact sync with the video.
As to your memory of Perlman in 1969 / 70. I can well imagine him playing in an exaggerated emphatic manner. I'm a little suprised he would play a lot of wrong notes, since at that time he was, technically, a really good violinist -
Either that or it's a VCR tape which was recorded/played back at inconsistent wrong speeds.


just not my cuppa.
Herman
2018-12-06 16:44:37 UTC
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Post by n***@gmail.com
Post by Herman
The Mendelssohn youtube that was mentioned is a prank. It's a video of IP playing Mendelssohn in his usual 'aren't we havin' fun?' way while some clever clogs plays horribly off pitch over it. It's quite clever, 'cause the wrong notes are in exact sync with the video.
Either that or it's a VCR tape which was recorded/played back at inconsistent wrong speeds.
It's a prank, and I'm suprised you don't see.

There's another Shred prank video in which Zukerman first talks a load of bullshit about his Strad (genuine) and then proceeds to shred a Bach prelude to pieces (prank)


AB
2018-12-06 16:58:49 UTC
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Post by n***@gmail.com
Post by Herman
Post by graham
The first time I saw/heard Perlman was at a concert in London in 1969 or
1970. He was the soloist with the ECO in the 4 Seasons. He "underlined"
quite a number of notes and, unfortunately, in my seat off to the side,
I was close to the back desk of the first violins. Every time Perlman
played a bum note, one of them looked at his partner with a look of
disgust. It was difficult to ignore.
The Mendelssohn youtube that was mentioned is a prank. It's a video of IP playing Mendelssohn in his usual 'aren't we havin' fun?' way while some clever clogs plays horribly off pitch over it. It's quite clever, 'cause the wrong notes are in exact sync with the video.
As to your memory of Perlman in 1969 / 70. I can well imagine him playing in an exaggerated emphatic manner. I'm a little suprised he would play a lot of wrong notes, since at that time he was, technically, a really good violinist -
Either that or it's a VCR tape which was recorded/played back at inconsistent wrong speeds.
just not my cuppa.
I trust that you are joking about the tape.

AB
AB
2018-12-06 16:55:36 UTC
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Post by HT
Post by AB
Post by HT
With string so much can go so horribly wrong. Also because the audience is as much a victim of a train wreck as the performer. Listen to Perlman's Mendelssohn on YT.
Henk
that is a joke....
Certainly not! Nothing hurts the ears as much as listening to a fiddler who plays out of tune. If Horowitz misses all the jumps in a Schumann-fantasie, it only gives the audience something to talk about during the break.
Henk
Henk,

I don't know the circumstances of the recording, but I have to assume it was a joke, meawing that Perlman deliberately played wrong notes. you can see him sort of smiling while he played.

Arri
Herman
2018-12-06 17:09:51 UTC
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Post by AB
I don't know the circumstances of the recording, but I have to assume it was a joke, meawing that Perlman deliberately played wrong notes. you can see him sort of smiling while he played.
He's always smiling. That's why he used to be such a popular violinist.

Why would Perlman hire an orchestra to play grotesquely out of pitch?

The tape has been overdubbed by a youtube prankster who's made a couple of those videos.
Herman
2018-12-06 17:19:33 UTC
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There's another one with Perlman 'shredding' (i.e. Fatpjerrot shredding) the Vivaldi.


Frank Berger
2018-12-06 17:21:32 UTC
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Post by Herman
Post by AB
I don't know the circumstances of the recording, but I have to assume it was a joke, meawing that Perlman deliberately played wrong notes. you can see him sort of smiling while he played.
He's always smiling. That's why he used to be such a popular violinist.
He's not always smiling. Often he grimaces. He still is a popular
violinist, although I suppose not as good as he was. Who is? If his
smile made him popular in the first place, why would he be less popular
now. There is no logic in what you say.
Post by Herman
Why would Perlman hire an orchestra to play grotesquely out of pitch?
Sense of humor perhaps?
Post by Herman
The tape has been overdubbed by a youtube prankster who's made a couple of those videos.
Herman
2018-12-06 17:43:46 UTC
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Post by Frank Berger
There is no logic in what you say.
Post by Herman
Why would Perlman hire an orchestra to play grotesquely out of pitch?
Sense of humor perhaps?
Just believe what you need to believe, and enjoy your sense of logic.

Don't check fatpjerrot videos, which has several violinists 'shredding' classics.
Frank Berger
2018-12-06 18:58:57 UTC
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Post by Herman
Post by Frank Berger
There is no logic in what you say.
Post by Herman
Why would Perlman hire an orchestra to play grotesquely out of pitch?
Sense of humor perhaps?
Just believe what you need to believe, and enjoy your sense of logic.
Don't check fatpjerrot videos, which has several violinists 'shredding' classics.
I didn't say you were wrong. I just answered your question.
AB
2018-12-06 19:52:15 UTC
Reply
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Post by Herman
Post by AB
I don't know the circumstances of the recording, but I have to assume it was a joke, meawing that Perlman deliberately played wrong notes. you can see him sort of smiling while he played.
He's always smiling. That's why he used to be such a popular violinist.
Why would Perlman hire an orchestra to play grotesquely out of pitch?
The tape has been overdubbed by a youtube prankster who's made a couple of those videos.
the above makes sense......there are times when the violin and orchestra are not together. definitely a prank

AB
HT
2018-12-06 18:38:21 UTC
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Arri, I misunderstood you. It may be that Perlman has cheated ( tempting the gods ). My mail was more in general about the fact that it can go so terribly wrong with string instruments. I was thinking of that poor Korean (?) lady (a prominent violinist with an important American orchestra) who had been invited by her homeland to perform as a soloist - and met her own iceberg. I couldn't find the video on YT anymore. Maybe there are still caring people on the internet ...

Henk
AB
2018-12-06 19:57:56 UTC
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Post by HT
Arri, I misunderstood you. It may be that Perlman has cheated ( tempting the gods ). My mail was more in general about the fact that it can go so terribly wrong with string instruments. I was thinking of that poor Korean (?) lady (a prominent violinist with an important American orchestra) who had been invited by her homeland to perform as a soloist - and met her own iceberg. I couldn't find the video on YT anymore. Maybe there are still caring people on the internet ...
Henk
as somebody said above. somebody(obviously an accomplished violinist) over-dubbed Perlman. an elaborate joke, thats all.
Arri

g***@gmail.com
2018-12-06 01:58:59 UTC
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Post by g***@gmail.com
Post by AB
Herman
how could one be considered a 'great violinist' if you dont have a solid technical foundation?????.
FYI tone and vibrato are not he same thing, at least not on the bassoon:-)
AB
Well, it's more like the technical foundation got worn out in the Sixties, in Stern's case. He wasn't a fanatical practicer. In order to keep your technique up to the highest level, you need to practice at least four to six hours a day, including an hour of mind-numbing scales...
- If I don't practice one day, I know it; two days, the critics know it; three days, the public knows it.
Jascha Heifetz
Nobody practiced more than me, but for some strange reason, it didn't always sound like it:

https://www.google.com/search?biw=1366&bih=657&tbm=isch&sa=1&ei=sSIIXI_yPOjB0PEPgfi_8Ag&q=i+don%27t+know+shrugging+shoulders&oq=i+don%27t+know+shrugging+shoulders&gs_l=img.3...146293.157009..157172...5.0..0.202.2603.31j2j1......1....1..gws-wiz-img.......0j35i39j0i8i30j0i24.QtqCI9HPc5k#imgrc=ILdOPEhsOmsdjM:
g***@gmail.com
2018-11-30 19:08:48 UTC
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Post by AB
Herman
how could one be considered a 'great violinist' if you dont have a solid technical foundation?????.
FYI tone and vibrato are not he same thing, at least not on the bassoon:-)
AB
Well, it's more like the technical foundation got worn out in the Sixties, in Stern's case. He wasn't a fanatical practicer. In order to keep your technique up to the highest level, you need to practice at least four to six hours a day, including an hour of mind-numbing scales. Stern didn't do that, and he spent that time working on his power network, having lunches with people that mattered and making phone calls. (Rosand mentions that Stern was keeping an eye on his concert schedule and had called every all the people he ran into just to control and limit Rosand - this may be a paranoid exaggeration, but there was something to it)...
- Ambition often puts men upon doing the meanest offices; so climbing is performed in the same posture with creeping.

Jonathan Swift
Herman
2018-12-01 21:38:26 UTC
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Here is the Brahms C major piano trio with Istomin, Stern and Rose.

It's a very good performance, and it from the early seventies, too.

The way I look at it it's Rose who keeps the performance together. Stern is a little reckless both left and right, but that makes it an interesting performance to see.

Rosand talked about Stern needing hundreds of edits in a recording; well, this is live and it's far from perfect, but not as bad as Rosand seems to say.
AB
2018-12-02 01:13:52 UTC
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Post by Herman
http://youtu.be/OZ5Z_xU2JVk
Here is the Brahms C major piano trio with Istomin, Stern and Rose.
It's a very good performance, and it from the early seventies, too.
The way I look at it it's Rose who keeps the performance together. Stern is a little reckless both left and right, but that makes it an interesting performance to see.
Rosand talked about Stern needing hundreds of edits in a recording; well, this is live and it's far from perfect, but not as bad as Rosand seems to say.
not sure what you mean by 'reckless'. his intonation is accurate, he plays with great intensity. at his best he was a great violinist-musician. But of course this is relatively easy music, technically speaking. Rosand was nowhere as an accomplished violinist.

AB
Herman
2018-12-02 11:24:59 UTC
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Post by AB
Post by Herman
http://youtu.be/OZ5Z_xU2JVk
Here is the Brahms C major piano trio with Istomin, Stern and Rose.
It's a very good performance, and it from the early seventies, too.
The way I look at it it's Rose who keeps the performance together. Stern is a little reckless both left and right, but that makes it an interesting performance to see.
Rosand talked about Stern needing hundreds of edits in a recording; well, this is live and it's far from perfect, but not as bad as Rosand seems to say.
not sure what you mean by 'reckless'. his intonation is accurate, he plays with great intensity. at his best he was a great violinist-musician. But of course this is relatively easy music, technically speaking. Rosand was nowhere as an accomplished violinist.
AB
The C major Trio is technically pretty tough for a piece of 19th C chamber music. Brahms was not like Dvorak who tends to write comfortably (though not always).

Like I said, this Paris performance by Istomin, Stern and Rose is pretty good, and very enjoyable, but (if you want to know) you can see Stern making a couple of slides up the fingerboard because he's not sure he would hit the right note. In a way it adds to the fun, because the listener can think "Oh, that's the way they did it in Brahms's time, too!" It's not the way they did it in 1974, however.
Herman
2018-12-02 14:19:36 UTC
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The slides are galore in the big melody in the scherzo's trio.
O
2018-12-03 16:40:41 UTC
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Post by Herman
The slides are galore in the big melody in the scherzo's trio.
I'm not enough of a violinist to detect any noticeable slides or
shakiness in Stern's playing, even in the scherzo. Whatever he's
doing, it doesn't spoil the effect.

I've always liked the Istomin-Stern-Rose Trio, especially the Beethoven
trios, which I've enjoyed for many years. I'd say the three of them
together transcend their individual abilities.

-Owen
Herman
2018-12-03 17:02:34 UTC
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Post by O
Post by Herman
The slides are galore in the big melody in the scherzo's trio.
I'm not enough of a violinist to detect any noticeable slides or
shakiness in Stern's playing, even in the scherzo. Whatever he's
doing, it doesn't spoil the effect.
http://youtu.be/OZ5Z_xU2JVk

There's one on 21:04, the repeat of the trio's big melody. The previous one, on 20:38, was a little bit cleaner.
O
2018-12-03 17:49:29 UTC
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Post by Herman
Post by O
Post by Herman
The slides are galore in the big melody in the scherzo's trio.
I'm not enough of a violinist to detect any noticeable slides or
shakiness in Stern's playing, even in the scherzo. Whatever he's
doing, it doesn't spoil the effect.
http://youtu.be/OZ5Z_xU2JVk
There's one on 21:04, the repeat of the trio's big melody. The previous one,
on 20:38, was a little bit cleaner.
Not being well versed in the instrumental, I would have assumed that
was done intentionally. You learn something everyday.

I suppose it's an equivalent of a pianist using the sustain pedal to
blur some passages he's having trouble with.

-Owen
Herman
2018-12-03 18:08:06 UTC
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Post by O
Post by Herman
Post by O
Post by Herman
The slides are galore in the big melody in the scherzo's trio.
I'm not enough of a violinist to detect any noticeable slides or
shakiness in Stern's playing, even in the scherzo. Whatever he's
doing, it doesn't spoil the effect.
http://youtu.be/OZ5Z_xU2JVk
There's one on 21:04, the repeat of the trio's big melody. The previous one,
on 20:38, was a little bit cleaner.
Not being well versed in the instrumental, I would have assumed that
was done intentionally. You learn something everyday.
I suppose it's an equivalent of a pianist using the sustain pedal to
blur some passages he's having trouble with.
-Owen
He's doing it intentionally, because this way you know where you end up (on the note), whereas when you shift rather than slide you might miss.
Steven Bornfeld
2018-12-03 18:51:07 UTC
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Wow, tough crowd! ;-)
I hear that as a portamento, and yes, intentional--not as a guide, but
as a romantic gesture.
Herman
2018-12-03 19:35:07 UTC
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Post by Steven Bornfeld
Wow, tough crowd! ;-)
I hear that as a portamento, and yes, intentional--not as a guide, but
as a romantic gesture.
Look at the Mendelssohn concerto from a couple years before in Amsterdam and you can see big shifts are a problem he likes to avoid.
Herman
2018-12-04 12:28:39 UTC
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I'm a totally lousy amateur player, but I went and played the big tune from the Scherzo's Trio myself and checked youtube again and I think I see what Stern is after. He wants to hit the high note with his index finger for big soprano vibrato.

When I look at the video with Tetzlaff I think I see he opts for the middle finger (not "giving it" but using it) which gives him more ease towards the high D and it's also easier on the way down. Ironically he also achieves a beautiful straight on vibrato into the bargain.

To me it looks like Tetzlaff thought about the fingering better and he's technically at his peak, which is iffy with Stern. That being said, the Istomin / Stern / Rose performance better music making, because Tetzlaff cello sister is no Du Pre, bless her heart.
Herman
2018-12-04 12:35:28 UTC
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I'm starting to look like ggg, talking to myself, but I forgot to post a link to the performance by the Tetzlaff Trio:


Steven Bornfeld
2018-12-04 15:35:27 UTC
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Post by Herman
http://youtu.be/gMYVqQQz3Ts
You're not--thanks for posting.

Steve
g***@gmail.com
2018-12-04 18:15:32 UTC
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Post by Steven Bornfeld
Post by Herman
http://youtu.be/gMYVqQQz3Ts
You're not--thanks for posting.
Steve
You always liked HIM better than ME:

https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&source=hp&biw=1366&bih=657&ei=AMIGXLKfN4S90wLv5LLoDw&q=smothers+brothers+arguing&oq=smothers+brothers+arguing&gs_l=img.3...334.5380..6009...0.0..2.622.4792.9j7j3j2j0j3......0....1..gws-wiz-img.....0..0j0i10j0i8i30j0i24.jc-636YZaTk#imgrc=Ux9CHIB2JRC1ZM:
Steven Bornfeld
2018-12-04 21:55:58 UTC
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Post by Steven Bornfeld
Post by Herman
http://youtu.be/gMYVqQQz3Ts
You're not--thanks for posting.
Steve
I love everybody
D***@aol.com
2018-12-03 17:10:31 UTC
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Post by O
Post by Herman
The slides are galore in the big melody in the scherzo's trio.
I'm not enough of a violinist to detect any noticeable slides or
shakiness in Stern's playing, even in the scherzo. Whatever he's
doing, it doesn't spoil the effect.
I've always liked the Istomin-Stern-Rose Trio, especially the Beethoven
trios, which I've enjoyed for many years. I'd say the three of them
together transcend their individual abilities.
-Owen
I remember a PBS television documentary about the group during the 1960s, when the Trio had only recently been formed. During a discussion/interview period, either Rose or Istomin said that Stern would make them angry with each other right before they went out to play -- with the result that they would "play up a storm." They clearly knew that Stern did it only to increase the intensity of their performance, not to cause genuine hostility. Stern's little grin while that was being said was delightful.

Don Tait
r***@gmail.com
2018-11-29 23:50:02 UTC
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Post by O
You don't happen to also go by the name, Isaac Stern, do you?
-Owen
Stern's tone has always repelled me.
I never heard Aaron Rosand play in person, but his recordings were fine. I did hear Stern play with orchestra in the mid-1970s. He was not a great violinist then. At that time I heard Milstein, Kyung-Wha Chung, and Perlman in concert. They were quite different from each other, but there was no doubt that they were 'Great Violinists' then.
I didn't buy many Stern recordings, but for Milstein and K-W Chung I bought most. It helped that they were mostly on European-pressed LPs. Rosand was not so the discs were often defective.
AB
2018-11-29 20:41:16 UTC
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I've been collecting classical recordings for over 50 years, so some of them
go a long time without being heard. I pulled a dusty CD off the shelf today
featuring violin encores played by Aaron Rosand, and it gave immense
pleasure. He plays with a beautiful, unforced tone, has a technique that does
everything the music requires without calling attention to itself, and he
phrases like a great singer. It's called "The Violinist," and it's on a
Vox-related label called Allegretto. Pianist Eileen Flissler aids and abets
cleanly and with appropriate self-effacement. I see it's on Spotify, so
listen for yourself. I will follow up with other Rosand recordings on
Spotify. Rosand never had a huge career, but recorded a lot and kept busy
with engagements and teaching positions. Do I remember correctly that Isaac
Stern disliked Rosand and was an impediment to Rosand's career?
https://open.spotify.com/album/1wSJAJ2nIcwg8WUIJhErIV?si=jKCkRFOcR1yg6iM
7tdLlyQ
Nicely played.
-Owen
heard quite a number of his recordings... IMO, the playing is not of the
highest level. his technique is really not effortless. lots of little slips, tone is not full.
You don't happen to also go by the name, Isaac Stern, do you?
-Owen
no

AB
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