Discussion:
Dudamel Ives
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Jacky Meirovici
2020-08-29 00:49:00 UTC
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I want to make a heads up for the new digital release on DG of the four numbered symphonies by Charles Ives performed live by the LAP and Dudamel.These recordings were made live not before long the lockdown in LA.
The performances were justly praised, including by our moderator.
Indeed,in my opinion, which is not that of an Ivesian, Dudamel betters some of the most hailed recordings in this repertory, mainly Bernstein or MTT
He has an extraordinary sense of detail which is critical for the entangled polyphonic lines in this music.Aside one of the best Fourth, I liked especially the First.If this work is considered generally as merely an essay on European music written by an American composer,here the performance intimates the "real Ives" with sudden changes of mood, rhythm and even as being on the verge of losing control.

Highly recommanded

J
Alex Brown
2020-08-29 07:27:44 UTC
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Post by Jacky Meirovici
I want to make a heads up for the new digital release on DG of the four numbered symphonies by Charles Ives performed live by the LAP and Dudamel.These recordings were made live not before long the lockdown in LA.
The performances were justly praised, including by our moderator.
Indeed,in my opinion, which is not that of an Ivesian, Dudamel betters some of the most hailed recordings in this repertory, mainly Bernstein or MTT
He has an extraordinary sense of detail which is critical for the entangled polyphonic lines in this music.Aside one of the best Fourth, I liked especially the First.If this work is considered generally as merely an essay on European music written by an American composer,here the performance intimates the "real Ives" with sudden changes of mood, rhythm and even as being on the verge of losing control.
Highly recommanded
J
Yes. I listened to #2 in a dutiful "let's hear what this new release is
like then" way, expected another Dude disappointment. But no - this is
the most convincing recording of that piece I've heard, and beautifully
recorded!
Oscar
2020-08-30 20:21:13 UTC
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Post by Alex Brown
Yes. I listened to #2 in a dutiful "let's hear what this new release is
like then" way, expected another Dude disappointment. But no - this is
the most convincing recording of that piece I've heard, and beautifully
recorded!
Did a cursory listen of 1, 3, 4 over last couple days. This is easily Dudamel's finest recording, and one of the best LA Phil recordings since the Mehta/Royce Hall/Decca days. Looking forward to sitting with this over the next week and really plugging into it. Impressed!
Neil
2020-08-31 11:12:32 UTC
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Post by Oscar
Did a cursory listen of 1, 3, 4 over last couple days. This is easily Dudamel's finest recording, and one of the best LA Phil recordings since the Mehta/Royce Hall/Decca days. Looking forward to sitting with this over the next week and really plugging into it. Impressed!
Good to know. I will check this out. Saw it appeared on Qobuz.
vhorowitz
2020-09-05 19:10:29 UTC
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I listened to the 4th, and was indeed impressed with his ear for detail. However in the 2nd mvt I feel that quest for detail (and probably the recording engineers help in separating strands) leads to a loss of strong characterization. Especially near the end of the movement what should be raucous brass taking over with gusto is almost effete. It’s very “beautiful” and for much of the work that’s a virtue, but not here. Certainly Stokowski yields to many successors overall, but THAT aspect he has in spades. It’s certainly a worthy release overall, and to me, is the first Dudamel release that is truly competitive with the best.
Robert Marshall
2020-08-31 08:48:25 UTC
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Post by Jacky Meirovici
I want to make a heads up for the new digital release on DG of the
four numbered symphonies by Charles Ives performed live by the LAP and
Dudamel.These recordings were made live not before long the lockdown
in LA.
The performances were justly praised, including by our moderator.
Our moderator???

But thanks for the pointer - marked for investigation!

Robert
--
Robert Marshall twitter: @rajm
Dirge
2020-09-05 22:51:06 UTC
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Post by Jacky Meirovici
I want to make a heads up for the new digital release on DG of the four numbered symphonies by Charles Ives performed live by the LAP and Dudamel.These recordings were made live not before long the lockdown in LA.
The performances were justly praised, including by our moderator.
Indeed,in my opinion, which is not that of an Ivesian, Dudamel betters some of the most hailed recordings in this repertory, mainly Bernstein or MTT
He has an extraordinary sense of detail which is critical for the entangled polyphonic lines in this music.Aside one of the best Fourth, I liked especially the First.If this work is considered generally as merely an essay on European music written by an American composer,here the performance intimates the "real Ives" with sudden changes of mood, rhythm and even as being on the verge of losing control.
Highly recommanded
J
Charles IVES: Symphony No. 4 (1910–1925)
:: Dudamel/LAPO [DG ’20]

This is a pretty compelling recording of the Fourth by today’s kinder, gentler Ives standards, but it strikes me as being euphemized compared to Stokowski/ASO [Columbia ’65]. The playing is crassless and inordinately rich and beautiful, big gestures tend to be downplayed, volatility tempered, and tension is relatively low. The heroic little trumpet fanfare eight or nine seconds into the first movement is rather understated, for example, as is the “Let heaven and nature sing” trombone at the end of the Fugue, and the raucous and hectic/chaotic sections of the “Comedy” movement sound comfortably raucous and hectic/chaotic, never flirting with disaster. Some of this may be on account of the different editions used since Stokowski’s day, as all newer accounts seem to downplay big gestures—although it’s certainly not out of the realm of possibility that Stokowski simply plays up big gestures. On the plus side, small gestures tend to be easier to discern, and Dudamel does a good job of idiomatically phrasing the myriad quotations that Ives crams into the work. The quieter and/or more mysterious music is played beautifully per se, but its effectiveness is slightly undermined by the low level of tension. All that said, I’m a decidedly crass, volatile, tension-craving, politically incorrect Ives listener, and many of the things that bother me here won’t bother other listeners at all and will likely please a great many of them. The recorded sound is colorful and easy on the ear but just a bit woolly, soft focused, and opaque, slightly dulling/blunting the impact of some of the playing.
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