Discussion:
Chopin op 45, Pogorelich and others
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Mandryka
2019-09-04 12:39:17 UTC
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Just found this one, slow but nonetheless well worth a listen I think, and decent sound too. If I were at a concert I’d be spellbound and up on my feet yelling bravo afterwards! At home it’s a different matter . . .


Mandryka
2019-09-04 12:45:11 UTC
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Correction, I had heard him play it, I have two recordings of him doing it in fact.

Another one I just found in my collection is Koroliov, this Koroliov is just the best modern piano person at playing counterpoint. I’ve noticed it many times before - in Beethoven, Mozart, Schumann and now here. Great pianist IMO, but paradoxically maybe he’s made less of an impression on me in Bach - maybe I know the music better and so am more critical.
JohnGavin
2019-09-04 17:40:09 UTC
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Just found this one, slow but nonetheless well worth a listen I think, and decent sound too. If I were at a concert I’d be spellbound and up on my feet yelling bravo afterwards! At home it’s a different matter . . .

http://youtu.be/g76EwVp3b5k

———————————————————/—-/
He tried very hard to bring out every nuance and subtlety of the peace. Michelangeli took a more objective approach, yet in my opinion, he brought out much more of the beauty and innear essence. I’m speaking particularly of his DG recording.
Bozo
2019-09-04 22:38:34 UTC
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Michelangeli took a more objective approach, yet in my opinion, he brought out much more of the beauty >and innear essence. I’m speaking particularly of his DG recording.
Michelangeli live in 1967 :


Sometimes less is more, but I'm not sure in these two comparisons.
y***@gmail.com
2019-09-06 04:59:00 UTC
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Post by Mandryka
Just found this one, slow but nonetheless well worth a listen I think, and decent sound too. If I were at a concert I’d be spellbound and up on my feet yelling bravo afterwards! At home it’s a different matter . . .
http://youtu.be/g76EwVp3b5k
Thanks for posting this, Mandryka. It gives a good impression of what the Pogorelich magic was like. It’s a shame what happened to him. I mentioned in another post that I heard him live in concert three times that were unforgettable events, and have almost all of the DG recordings. At one time he was, in my opinion, a very great artist with compelling (albeit sometimes provocative) musical ideas, a riveting stage presence, stunning virtuosity, gorgeous tone, and ardent emotionality.
Mandryka
2019-09-06 10:41:00 UTC
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Another one I’ve been listening to is Arrau’s - I’ve been noticing how harmonically interesting the music.
Bozo
2019-09-06 12:49:00 UTC
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. I mentioned in another post that I heard him live in concert three times that were unforgettable events, >and have almost all of the DG recordings.
Never heard him live, have 3 of his early cd's.For me the DGG coupling of the Scriabin 2nd Sonata and Liszt Sonata is a must for pianophiles.
Frank Berger
2019-09-06 13:35:17 UTC
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Post by Bozo
. I mentioned in another post that I heard him live in concert three times that were unforgettable events, >and have almost all of the DG recordings.
Never heard him live, have 3 of his early cd's.For me the DGG coupling of the Scriabin 2nd Sonata and Liszt Sonata is a must for pianophiles.
Article about Pogorelich by Peter Donahue from 2015:

https://tinyurl.com/yyyrgl7s

Not sure what to make of it. It seems to blame the media for Pogorelich
failing to outgrow his eccentricities and becoming the pianist he could
have been.
Bozo
2019-09-06 16:47:45 UTC
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Post by Frank Berger
Not sure what to make of it. It seems to blame the media for Pogorelich
failing to outgrow his eccentricities and becoming the pianist he could
have been.
Not sure, either, very rambling, although he seems to assess some blame as well to the dissenting 1980 jurors and the pianist( or his teachers ) as well.
Mandryka
2019-09-06 20:42:29 UTC
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On the one hand you have a discourse of experts - critics, competition juries etc - who have the authority to decide what is eccentric and what is not. In a way like a doctor has the power to decide what is mad and what is sane.

And on the other hand you have the public, who have some sort of memory of a time when eccentricity was allied to genius, like when mad people were thought to be blessed with divine grace.

This is a really interesting tension. We don’t know whether to listen to Pogorelich, to take him seriously, or not.

(I’ve been reading Foucault recently! )
Frank Berger
2019-09-06 21:27:02 UTC
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Post by Mandryka
On the one hand you have a discourse of experts - critics, competition juries etc - who have the authority to decide what is eccentric and what is not. In a way like a doctor has the power to decide what is mad and what is sane.
And on the other hand you have the public, who have some sort of memory of a time when eccentricity was allied to genius, like when mad people were thought to be blessed with divine grace.
This is a really interesting tension. We don’t know whether to listen to Pogorelich, to take him seriously, or not.
(I’ve been reading Foucault recently! )
Let's assume there is such a thing as "good" art, however defined. That
is a different concept than "what I like." Faced with a choice between
listening to something I like that "bad" and something I don't like,
that is "good," what should I listen to? The only reason to listen to
the latter is to hope to learn why it is "good."
Mandryka
2019-09-07 05:40:36 UTC
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Because the bad art may have lots to say which the good art passes over.
Bozo
2019-09-07 13:25:59 UTC
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Post by Frank Berger
The only reason to listen to
the latter is to hope to learn why it is "good."
That's a good reason to listen, and worth some time. For example, I have listened to Sibelius' 4th Symphony several times over the years, and while I adore almost all other Sibelius ( his VC probably my fav VC of all ),and have some understanding why most consider the 4th " good ", I do not connect with the 4th,although would not classify it as " bad". The exercise has helped me understand why I do like other Sibelius and even other music in general. Same goes for the Boulez piano sonatas, although I may not have such a charitable conclusion about them.
Todd Michel McComb
2019-09-07 05:49:01 UTC
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I've been reading Foucault recently!
Then I suggest the relatively recent -- apropos music -- _The Order
of Sounds_ (the titles/translations paralleling Foucault) by Francois
J. Bonnet. It's the most interesting discussion of contemporary
sound aesthetics I've read of late.
Mandryka
2019-09-07 07:56:58 UTC
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Post by Todd Michel McComb
I've been reading Foucault recently!
Then I suggest the relatively recent -- apropos music -- _The Order
of Sounds_ (the titles/translations paralleling Foucault) by Francois
J. Bonnet. It's the most interesting discussion of contemporary
sound aesthetics I've read of late.
Les mots et les sons, I'll read it in French.
dk
2019-09-19 06:17:44 UTC
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Post by Mandryka
Just found this one, slow but nonetheless well worth a listen I think, and decent sound too. If I were at a concert I’d be spellbound and up on my feet yelling bravo afterwards! At home it’s a different matter . . .
http://youtu.be/g76EwVp3b5k
Michelangeli owns it.

dk

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